whatamidoing
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 17, 2014 21:19:15 GMT -5
I have a dual 3lb tumbler. I only started tumbling about a month or so ago. I have been tumbling mostly flint. I have already cleaned each barrel 3 times and reloaded them. No problems until now. I started each time with 6 tablespoons of water and 2 tbsp of 60/90 grit. After 2 days I check and add 2 more tbsp of grit. Another 2 days and 2 more tbsp. another 2 days and 2 more tbsp grit. Then after 4 days I rinsed the rocks, cleaned barrels and restarted again. At anytime if it looked dry I used a squirt bottle to clean around the lip of the barrel and that adds a small amount of water. The slurry looked like to be good according to what I have seen pictures of and read about. This time I restarted the barrels on Sunday. I decided to let them tumble until tonight, Friday. 5 days. Here's what I got tonight. So two questions. Why all the foam, and what do I do with it now? Thanks!
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 18, 2014 0:04:51 GMT -5
Flint is really tough and takes a good bit of abuse in a big tumbler. 3 pound tumbler is pretty gentle. So using less water should be safe.
I would use the recommended dose of grit, no more. Extra girt can cause reactions. Filling the barrel to 3/4 full of rocks. A balance of rock sizes from small to large. All 1 inch rocks is not so good. No metal. No concrete. Does your flint have a lot of white limestone attached to it ?
About the most likely problem is too much water. 6 tablespoons does not sound like much. But the less water the less likely foam is going to develop. And if you fill the barrel 3/4 full of rocks and can see water after it is added then foam is way more likely.
I would add water to the point it is one inch below the rocks or a bit less. the problem w/adding a pre-measured dose of water is void volume. If you have a lot of tiny rocks there is little room for water.
I fill mine up to the rock level and then tilt it on a fixed jig that pours the water off to a fixed LEVEL. Regardless of the void volume. No guessing and quick.
Pour the contents into a tub and add water and pour the top layer of water off being careful not to pour your unused grit off. The 60/90 is heavy and will easily settle to the bottom. As the water gets clearer from repeated pour offs you can see the grit. Repeat till water is clear. Salvage the grit after removing the rocks by hand, but wash the grit off each handful of rocks over the tub to get the grit. Put the clean rocks back to 3/4 full. Add suggested amount of (now wet) grit.
Try 4 tablespoons of water. Check it each day. Some put Tums or baking soda in. I don't. I would put 1 cup of sugar in, but that's me. Good luck.
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whatamidoing
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since August 2014
Posts: 86
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 18, 2014 9:06:48 GMT -5
Thanks James. Water on, water off. Rinse, refill. Sugar to sweeten. Got it! 1cup sugar for 3 pound barrel. 2cup sugar for 6 pound barrel?
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tkvancil
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Post by tkvancil on Oct 18, 2014 9:27:04 GMT -5
Foam in and of itself isn't always bad. If the rocks are making gas as they grind your barrels will bulge and the lid could pop off. If the barrels aren't bulging you are probably okay.
Some rocks that I have tumbled made foam in the beginning of the tumble, first couple weeks, but then no longer foamed. Those rocks always had some softer material in them. Not sure about flint having soft stuff in it, haven't tumbled any.
I use 1/2 cup (8 tbs.) water in my 3# barrels. I know many people do use 6tbs. which I tried. Our tap water has a lot of minerals and with 6 tbs. my slurry got too thick. You have two barrels so you could put distilled in one and tap water in the other, this would tell you if it is something in the water.
If your going to try adding something don't use baking soda. Tried that and in two days the barrel was swollen and ready to pop. Borax works to a point to control foam. It will thicken the slurry quite a bit though.
I am curious as to why you were adding grit every two days. How well did that work? Was the grit breaking down?
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whatamidoing
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since August 2014
Posts: 86
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 18, 2014 11:30:14 GMT -5
I was using this as a guide. forum.rocktumblinghobby.com/post/415564/threadI don't think the grit was being totally used up, that's why I let it go a few days longer this time. The stones are rounding, and I know that flint can take a long time so just kept putting them back in and adding filler. I am guessing that the filler I put in this time might be the culprit. Not exactly sure what it was, just that it was small and I needed more of those and didn't want to use media. I am totally open to any suggestions that might work better. Just trying to find my way right now. --Kathy
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whatamidoing
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since August 2014
Posts: 86
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 18, 2014 13:38:02 GMT -5
I drained both barrels using jamesp suggestion. Thank you! Took more pictures. What was in each barrel and what is returning to each barrel. Barrels loaded with rock. Trying to show level of rock in the barrels better. With 2 tbsp 60/90 grit. One barrel contains the wet grit leftover from the foam slurry. Also one barrel with 4 tbsp of tap water and the other 4 tbsp of distilled water. Thanks for that suggestion tkvancil! Water not even close to being seen in picture. Also added 1 cup of sugar to each barrel. Forgot to take picture. But once the sugar was in before being tumbled everything came up just short of the lip of the barrels. I will check it again tonight and see how things look.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 18, 2014 21:42:41 GMT -5
The sugar will dissolve. But still raise the level a bit after rolling a while. If it raises the level too much pour some off so that level is 1 inch below rocks. Then let her roll. Nice mix of rocks.
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The Dad_Ohs
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Post by The Dad_Ohs on Oct 18, 2014 23:09:32 GMT -5
I always get foam like that in my barrels.... never had an issue as there was no pressure behind it. The foam actually holds some of the grit within in so there is always grit near the surface as the rocks tumble, this also means that the grit is moving throughout the mix better and , at least for me, gives better results. I wouldn't sweat it as long as your not getting bulges.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 19, 2014 7:00:24 GMT -5
Foam may not be a problem for the actual grinding process. The main concern I have about a foamy load is increased chance of blowing a lid off the tumbler.
Foam and /or gas pressure is invited when coarse grinding obsidian, it serves as an indicator that material is being removed. If not creating gas/foam then it is probably not grinding well. Obsidian is full of tiny pressurized gas pockets throughout. And material removal during coarse grind releases them into the sealed barrel. And it is a given that the gas be burped out daily, or at least checked daily.
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whatamidoing
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since August 2014
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 19, 2014 10:31:56 GMT -5
Both barrels are rolling in the syrup grit soup. No foam in either of them. I appreciate the replays!
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Oct 19, 2014 12:12:22 GMT -5
Both barrels are rolling in the syrup grit soup. No foam in either of them. I appreciate the replays! Everything is a balance. If they get too thick of a syrup a tiny bit of water will thin them out. Shooting for warm pancake syrup consistency or somewhat thinner. Warm motor oil...same viscosity that protects an engine. I was a little worried about 4 tbsp vs 6 tbsp being on the thick side. Best start out thick and add bit of water after.
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whatamidoing
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since August 2014
Posts: 86
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 19, 2014 16:28:54 GMT -5
Both barrels are rolling in the syrup grit soup. No foam in either of them. I appreciate the replays! Everything is a balance. If they get too thick of a syrup a tiny bit of water will thin them out. Shooting for warm pancake syrup consistency or somewhat thinner. Warm motor oil...same viscosity that protects an engine. I was a little worried about 4 tbsp vs 6 tbsp being on the thick side. Best start out thick and add bit of water after. Thanks James! I will check them again to see what kind of syrup I got.
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whatamidoing
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since August 2014
Posts: 86
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Post by whatamidoing on Oct 19, 2014 22:28:25 GMT -5
The barrel with the distilled water seems to be the consistency you are talking about. Barrel wit tap water was thicker, so I added a couple squirts of water. Check them both tommorrow.
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