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Post by talkingstones on Jan 7, 2014 8:00:25 GMT -5
Thanks all and thanks for the tips!!! Tela, I was waiting for my solder to arrive from Rio when I was working this bead but really was itching to get started with something so went with what I had on hand. Also, I think that if you're going to start, better to start on less than top quality stuff. That way, when you do screw up, it's not such a huge disappointment and waste that you won't come back to it. Once the medium jewelers solder chips did arrive, I found that the Home Depot stuff was easier to work with as it has a much lower melting point. With the amount of scrap I went through and the price of good solder, I'm glad I didn't waste the good solder but think I'm going to mess around with different types of solder to see what I like. I definitely like cutting my own compared to working with the chips!!!! Wouldn't have known that unless I tried! The flux was also Home Depot stuff and I'm going to be messing around with other types of that as well...but think for these first few projects, I'm going to stick with the cheap stuff! If I can master it with that, then the good stuff should be a breeze! Kind of like learning to wire wrap with stainless. Once I got to the silver, it was a piece of cake! Overall, I think the biggest "problem" I had with this project was inexperience. I had never worked with a torch and metal in this way and just getting used to what happens when you heat metal and how different metals react to each other and heat and flux and solder was really cool!!!! It's a completely different process than anything I've worked before and merits further experimentation, I think! It's going to be a while before I get to the point of being able to sell anything with the smithing, if I ever do, but I can explore with my scrap stuff and learn through the process. For me, that's the biggest part of what this is about. If I don't enjoy it, I haven't really lost anything, but if I do enjoy it, I can invest more into it. Right now while I'm finding out, I'm going to use what I have around, fill in minimally where I have to, and then proceed once I've developed a skill level ...and any skill level would be good at this point, lol!!! Anyway, onward and upward... Cathy
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 7, 2014 8:31:57 GMT -5
Hey Cathy I didn't know if you knew abt the solder or not and figured to err on the side of wanting to try to help you out. I would have felt bad had I not said something. I completely understand abt working with what you have. That's what I am doing as well. All my stuff isn't in yet either, but I had to have a go. I'm getting ready to post abt it. Are you having fun yet?? I'm having a HUGE blast. Where has this been all my life??!!
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Post by talkingstones on Jan 7, 2014 19:02:49 GMT -5
Hi Tela, No worries! I am having fun with it at this point. It's a lot to explore and I see a lot of directions to go with it, so we will see how it goes!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Member since January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2014 22:10:11 GMT -5
anything that involves fire is good for me!
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Post by connrock on Jan 8, 2014 12:10:01 GMT -5
Cathy,,,,I think your project was VERY ambitious for a first try at metal work! To be able to solder something like that is NOT easy to do for someone with a bit of experience yet you got it done and you're scrap bowl proves that your no quitter!
I don't want you to get confused about different types of flux but the flux you used on this project won't work with silver solder.There are tons of different types of fluxes used on different types of metals and different applications,even different temps on the same metals so it's very important to match the flux with the metal/solder your using. I hope to see more of your metal work after you get some time to get back to it! connrock
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Post by talkingstones on Jan 12, 2014 1:28:30 GMT -5
Dave, can you tell me about flux's and solder? I got some medium silver solder and it doesn't seem to melt or ball with anything, including the flux I'm using.
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steelandstone
has rocks in the head
Member since September 2008
Posts: 500
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Post by steelandstone on Jan 12, 2014 9:29:33 GMT -5
Dave, can you tell me about flux's and solder? I got some medium silver solder and it doesn't seem to melt or ball with anything, including the flux I'm using. Cathy, I can not speak for Connrock as to which fluxes he uses but he is 100% correct that the flux for the "Plumbers" solder you used will not work with silver solder. It has to be one meant for "Hard Soldering" I have tried many different fluxes and now use these two just about 95% of the time. They will work with all Hard, Medium, Easy and Extra easy silver solders. Currently I use a self pickling flux from Rio. Here is the link My-T-FluxI also use this Gel Flux exclusively for joining the edges of the bezel tape together it works really well. Gel FluxYour final bead came out really nice. One other note the problem you stated about after soldering and trying to bend/shape the piece it kept breaking. That should not happen when you use the actual silver solder if anything once properly soldered the joint will be as strong if not stronger than the surrounding metal.
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Post by connrock on Jan 12, 2014 11:47:11 GMT -5
steelandstone,,, I tried different types of hard solder fluxes and still like the Handy Past Flux. I guess it boils down to,,,,different flux for different folks! LOL Its' the end product that counts! connrock
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Post by 1dave on Jan 12, 2014 11:48:55 GMT -5
Dave, can you tell me about flux's and solder? I got some medium silver solder and it doesn't seem to melt or ball with anything, including the flux I'm using. Cathy, I think you have Sharr's Gold and Silversmithing book. On p 60 she gives some excellent information on fluxes. "the flux should become fluid at a temperature just below that of the melted solder. Both metal and flux arrive at the correct soldering temperature at the same time." She goes on to say the best flux is made of equal amounts of borax and boric acid as liquid or paste. This flux becomes fluid at 1400 o F. It can be thinned with water or alcohol, thinner for thin gauged metal, thicker for heavier gauged metal. In awkward areas make a "holding flux" by heating borax to a glass, grinding it to a powder and mixing it with white Vaseline. I like what Jerry Davis has to say at: Notes about Flux
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steelandstone
has rocks in the head
Member since September 2008
Posts: 500
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Post by steelandstone on Jan 12, 2014 12:27:31 GMT -5
steelandstone,,, I tried different types of hard solder fluxes and still like the Handy Past Flux. I guess it boils down to,,,,different flux for different folks! LOL Its' the end product that counts! connrock So true, See and I on the other hand started with handy flux and then went to the self pickling. But you are right it is the end product that counts!
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Post by rockjunquie on Jan 12, 2014 12:40:09 GMT -5
I'm using Handy Flux paste flux. It was recommended to me by someone I know and respect, but I really don't like it. What works for one person may not work for another. I want to try some others soon. I have a big tub of this stuff to use in the meantime. I found that taking a small amount of it out of the big tub, putting it in a jelly mason jar and adding a little water has helped a lot to keep it the consistency that I want. I am glad I stuck with it at first though because of the heat indicators that it provides.
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Post by connrock on Jan 14, 2014 10:48:50 GMT -5
I use Handy Flux paste and apply it using a small artists paint brush. I use it in the container it comes in and if it starts to get too thick I squirt water in and stir it up until it's the right consistency(for me).I like it a bit thinner then how it originally comes. As you know,the flux goes through 4 stages,wet,dry/white,clear and then it flows. I don't pout my solder pallions on the piece(s) until I've heated the flux to it's clear stage.This eliminates chasing,repositioning ,and sometimes,solder "popping away" as the flux goes through it's different stages. Sometimes if I'm doing multiple joints I preheat the wet fluxed joints with a heat gun so it's at least dry,,,in the white stage,then go in with the torch and add the solder with a pick.Once I get the solder on all of the joints I heat the entire piece until the solder flows. Again,,,,personal preference! connrock
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