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Post by aDave on Aug 17, 2019 1:10:36 GMT -5
I picked up a Lot-O in the beginning of the year, and I've probably finished eight or so batches since obtaining it. For the most part, I'm using the "standard" recipe as found here on RTH with just slightly less Borax when called for in stages. Based upon what I've seen on the 'net, I think mine circulates material a bit more slowly than what I've seen in vids, but I haven't gone far enough to move the dowel to speed things up. Nevertheless, I've still gotten good results.
My issue lately is with the polish stage. I've seen others complain about the 120/220 stage being tough to manage, but I'm able to work my way through that. For me, however, the polish stage has been the toughest to keep stuff moving and I couldn't get more than 24 hours in that stage in my last batch.
For the polish stage, I'll load up my barrel and water is drained off appropriately. When I start up the Lot-O, the rocks will barely circulate initially. But, as soon as I add my 1/2 tsp of polish, the contents of the barrel circulate as I would expect. 2 tsp of Borax are then added. No issue here thus far other than stuff not beginning to move until grit is added.
As the 24 hour mark is approached and grit has worn, things REALLY begin to slow down to a creep. Material is still wet and the slurry is not too thick. But, there is almost no circulation of material. With this last batch, I pulled stuff after 24 hours in polish as everything was pretty much standing still and no movement was taking place. Yeah, it was shiny, but with the "short" run in polish, I feel like I'm not getting as much as I can in a finished product.
Has anyone else experienced this? If so, how did you work through it? I think I'm dealing with a (lack of) friction problem, as stuff doesn't really start moving in this stage until I add polish. In a mixed batch of rocks, I'm probably near 30% of mixed ceramics in relation to the rocks. Right now, I'm kind of at a loss in how to extend my polish time, but I've been fighting a losing battle thus far.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Aug 17, 2019 7:14:16 GMT -5
I use only 1 TbL borax with any polish or stages except final burnish I use 2. Try that?
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Post by aDave on Aug 17, 2019 12:39:27 GMT -5
I use only 1 TbL borax with any polish or stages except final burnish I use 2. Try that? Perhaps that's something to try - bumping up the Borax dose to 1 TBSP at the start of the polish stage. I cut back to 2/3 TBSP when I started using the Lot-O as it seemed to make things too thick, or so I thought. Maybe that extra goo that is formed with the Borax helps to "grab" the rocks and helps to keep them moving. Don't know, but it can't hurt to try. Thanks.
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tomg
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2019
Posts: 103
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Post by tomg on Aug 17, 2019 21:56:51 GMT -5
Have you tried spritzing with water? That's the fix in my UV-10 and my MT4 for slow action.
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El JeffA
spending too much on rocks
Member since February 2016
Posts: 353
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Post by El JeffA on Aug 17, 2019 22:25:13 GMT -5
I came across this by accident... I always seemed to over-water by spraying when I first started due to slowing of action. I would unplug, drain with hand over opening, put back in frame, and action would return. Now I turn the barrel. When action slows down, try turning the barrel 90 degrees...without losing contact with the frame. I pick up and pull forward while staying in contact with the front of frame and twist about 90 degrees. I will bet you see better action without adding water. Hope this helps. Jeff A
Edit, this is for the Lot-O tumbler...
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Post by aDave on Aug 17, 2019 23:29:07 GMT -5
Have you tried spritzing with water? That's the fix in my UV-10 and my MT4 for slow action. Thanks Tom, but it's not dry. Remember, the first sign of any issue is upon startup of the polish stage when I turn on the Lot-O to add grit. Nothing really moves until the polish is added, then things are fine (normal) for a while. Water makes it worse when well into the stage. I've tried.
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Post by aDave on Aug 17, 2019 23:31:24 GMT -5
I came across this by accident... I always seemed to over-water by spraying when I first started due to slowing of action. I would unplug, drain with hand over opening, put back in frame, and action would return. Now I turn the barrel. When action slows down, try turning the barrel 90 degrees...without losing contact with the frame. I pick up and pull forward while staying in contact with the front of frame and twist about 90 degrees. I will bet you see better action without adding water. Hope this helps. Jeff A Edit, this is for the Lot-O tumbler... Thanks Jeff. What you do with re-draining the barrel mid-stage is what I do to ensure I haven't over-watered. So far, too-much water does not seem to be an issue, and material is wet. I'll try your 90 degree rotation as well. Thanks.
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Post by TheRock on Aug 18, 2019 14:54:06 GMT -5
I will add this and I don't mean it to Nock the Lot"O" but the UV-10 and UV-18 is not near as Finicky to operate as The Lot "O's" which I have 3 of. I can Load up Both at the same time and I don't have to open the UV's only to move to the next stage The LOT"O"s are very finnicky with water amount and slurry In my opinion they work better with 3/4 TBL spoon of Borax and 1/2 to 1 teaspoon of grit. When I start off I use 10 sprays or sprits to make up for the powders added. I find each Day I need to add 10 Sprays or sprits of water and use a Stick to churn up Mixture. Like evary one else has mentioned the Slurry gets thick quickly and can damn near come to a stop. Normally I use 3 days for each stage 220, then 500, Then .3 micron. For Obstian I may go up to a week on that last stage.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Aug 18, 2019 19:10:48 GMT -5
I don't see anything that you're doing wrong. If you suspect that your machine is running slower than normal, I would suspect that is the problem. My polish stage runs just like the other stages. I use 1 TBSP of borax, but I don't remember noticing it running slower than normal before adding borax.
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Post by aDave on Aug 18, 2019 21:29:33 GMT -5
I don't see anything that you're doing wrong. If you suspect that your machine is running slower than normal, I would suspect that is the problem. My polish stage runs just like the other stages. I use 1 TBSP of borax, but I don't remember noticing it running slower than normal before adding borax. Thanks Rob. What about before you add your polish? Is it running any slower before the abrasive is added? That's where I first noticed any sign of an issue. With just water-wetted rocks, they don't move well after the machine is turned on. Add polish, and then all is well until about 20 hours pass (at least that's the way it was with the last batch). The more I go through this (mental) exercise, a phone call to the company is probably in order.
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saxplayer
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since March 2018
Posts: 1,327
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Post by saxplayer on Aug 18, 2019 21:36:18 GMT -5
I don't see anything that you're doing wrong. If you suspect that your machine is running slower than normal, I would suspect that is the problem. My polish stage runs just like the other stages. I use 1 TBSP of borax, but I don't remember noticing it running slower than normal before adding borax. Mine definitely doesn’t run well until I add borax or grit or polish. It helps grip the rocks somehow.
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Post by aDave on Aug 18, 2019 22:03:53 GMT -5
I don't see anything that you're doing wrong. If you suspect that your machine is running slower than normal, I would suspect that is the problem. My polish stage runs just like the other stages. I use 1 TBSP of borax, but I don't remember noticing it running slower than normal before adding borax. Mine definitely doesn’t run well until I add borax or grit or polish. It helps grip the rocks somehow. Thanks Grant. Nice to see I'm not the only one.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Aug 18, 2019 22:22:12 GMT -5
I don't see anything that you're doing wrong. If you suspect that your machine is running slower than normal, I would suspect that is the problem. My polish stage runs just like the other stages. I use 1 TBSP of borax, but I don't remember noticing it running slower than normal before adding borax. Thanks Rob. What about before you add your polish? Is it running any slower before the abrasive is added? That's where I first noticed any sign of an issue. With just water-wetted rocks, they don't move well after the machine is turned on. Add polish, and then all is well until about 20 hours pass (at least that's the way it was with the last batch). The more I go through this (mental) exercise, a phone call to the company is probably in order. I can’t say for sure, but I don’t think I’ve ever noticed anything unusual before or after adding borax and grit.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Aug 18, 2019 22:24:36 GMT -5
Go to 41:40 in the video. (Edited time)
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Post by aDave on Aug 18, 2019 22:33:12 GMT -5
Rob, is there a typo in your time? Not sure what you wanted me to see, but I watched the start of your polish stage, and there is no discernible difference from your startup to adding stuff to it. I wish my machine rolled like yours does. Absent a phone call, maybe it's time to start thinking again about moving the dowel. Next time I start a batch, which might be a couple weeks, I'll take some short vids and let you take a look at them for reference.
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Post by Jugglerguy on Aug 19, 2019 6:54:03 GMT -5
Rob, is there a typo in your time? Not sure what you wanted me to see, but I watched the start of your polish stage, and there is no discernible difference from your startup to adding stuff to it. I wish my machine rolled like yours does. Absent a phone call, maybe it's time to start thinking again about moving the dowel. Next time I start a batch, which might be a couple weeks, I'll take some short vids and let you take a look at them for reference. Yep, 41:40 is the start of the polish stage. Sorry about that.
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JBe
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2019
Posts: 103
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Post by JBe on Aug 19, 2019 10:37:33 GMT -5
It may be worth checking that your counterweights are aligned in the two fan wheels. They should both be clocked in the same position inside the fans. The fans are a friction fit to the shaft so you can just rotate them to adjust the alignment.
FWIW- I use 1 tablespoon Borax in every stage after 120/220 and none in the 120/220 stage.
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Post by aDave on Aug 19, 2019 10:46:00 GMT -5
It may be worth checking that your counterweights are aligned in the two fan wheels. They should both be clocked in the same position inside the fans. The fans are a friction fit to the shaft so you can just rotate them to adjust the alignment. FWIW- I use 1 tablespoon Borax in every stage after 120/220 and none in the 120/220 stage. Thanks. That was one of the first things I looked at, and they are still aligned as they should be. I also checked the springs to make sure that none were broken, and they look good. Lastly, I've also checked that none of the welds on the frame were broken.
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JBe
starting to spend too much on rocks
Member since January 2019
Posts: 103
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Post by JBe on Aug 19, 2019 13:00:29 GMT -5
The only other random thing I can think of that hasn't been mentioned here is load composition. I generally run ~50% total volume or more small ceramic media depending on the assortment of rock I'm tumbling. The only times I've had impaired movement not due to the load being too wet/dry has been when I had too much rock or too many large rocks. I may not be maximizing my yield but I'm happy with the results.
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Post by aDave on Aug 19, 2019 17:41:38 GMT -5
The only other random thing I can think of that hasn't been mentioned here is load composition. I generally run ~50% total volume or more small ceramic media depending on the assortment of rock I'm tumbling. The only times I've had impaired movement not due to the load being too wet/dry has been when I had too much rock or too many large rocks. I may not be maximizing my yield but I'm happy with the results. Good point, and that's one of the things on my list to try. Right now I'm at about 30% mixed ceramics. When I get a chance, I was going to fill the barrel with ceramics that have gone all the way through polish to see how those are impacted with water only. Problem is, if the load does turn (as opposed to rocks and ceramics), I don't know if I can make the call yet to say it was exclusively a fill issue, though it will be a start. Thanks for reminding me.
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