jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 9, 2020 19:20:20 GMT -5
I got in trouble chasing the pups around with the drone. Wife had to discipline... Do you get kaolin in dried chunks or a liquid ? Shame on you! I get my kaolin in a powder; that's all I've ever seen from my soap suppliers; needs to blend into oils to make a very fine liquid mix. You can definitely feel a difference on the skin when I've added it. I've been googling all morning trying to find in another format for my rocks. Rest assured soap grade kaolin would be really pure. Unlikely that any sharp quartz sand particles were left in it. Thinking it is cheaper and goes further if using pure powdered kaolin than this liquid form. Oops, approaching the 3rd hour in the kaolin polish test. Must pull samples(am late to party). My vibe has two 4 pound hoppers. Divided. One side is running 1 tablespoon AO 14,000 polish w/k pectate, the other just straight k pectate. It would be a victory if either has a polish... Remember Kaopectate, they no longer use kaolin, they switched to a colloidal bismuth compound same as Pepto Bismol. Don't know why.
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Post by mohs on Sept 9, 2020 19:26:49 GMT -5
Obviously clay is a foundational subastance No need for me to remind any one Of its importance to the ancients First they snapped flint Sharp tools And it sparks Fire ! Butchered meat BBQ ! Soon Beer was invented party And they needed away to store the brew Clay pottery ! They should have stopped there m hstly
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 9, 2020 20:11:32 GMT -5
Obviously clay is a foundational subastance No need for me to remind any one Of its importance to the ancients First they snapped flint Sharp tools And it sparks Fire ! Butchered meat BBQ ! Soon Beer was invented party And they needed away to store the brew Clay pottery ! They should have stopped there m hstly African Americans eat kaolin for stomach ailments, other races do to but here in the south this tradition is popular Edmostly. I believe this practice was brought over from Africa and is heavily practiced to this day. I knew a fellow that owned a car wash that had a large exposure of kaolin where grading exposed it, his employees ingested it constantly. It finally dawned on him why his commodes were constantly plugging up. Just like slurry does. This is the most common form consumed often called cake or chunk
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Post by mohs on Sept 9, 2020 20:17:15 GMT -5
ha ha James ! I'm not sure I knew of that but I used to eat dirt maybe I still do ? but the mask as been helping mostly and now we know the origin of how many ways can you polish a turd ? always fun
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 9, 2020 20:35:19 GMT -5
Kaolin pectate 4 polish after 30 hours AO 220 and 3 hours AO 14,000. That be fast. My first clay slurry polish. Note corallite finger print patterns in flat coral. The patterns do not take polish as they are microscopically porous. One of the Rio's is with tiny pits but sweet color. And shiny. Will pull some samples before turning in at 7 hour mark. Let them run till morning, then clean out. Better to have rocks dry before adding the kaolin pectate 4, otherwise it gets darn wet and loses thickness. It is still is working, but I don't like watery slurry and waiting for tumbles to dry before adding slurry thickener. Maybe a 10 minute drain would do enough to remove moisture.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 9, 2020 20:41:00 GMT -5
ha ha James ! I'm not sure I knew of that but I used to eat dirt maybe I still do ? but the mask as been helping mostly and now we know the origin of how many ways can you polish a turd ? always fun Ed - It is called Geophagia or 'earth eating'.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 9, 2020 20:46:23 GMT -5
ha ha James ! I'm not sure I knew of that but I used to eat dirt maybe I still do ? but the mask as been helping mostly and now we know the origin of how many ways can you polish a turd ? always fun Wife reports that kaolin pectate 4 converted the puppy's diarrhea into polished Tootsie Rolls ! Tasty Tootsie Rolls probably not !
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Post by parfive on Sept 10, 2020 0:20:10 GMT -5
Clay is an interesting resource. Pitcher mound clay comes from selected locations for it to qualify as official. But [Tom Seaver] never forgot the promise he made his father, Charles, and USC baseball coach Rod Dedeaux that he would get his college degree. When Grande visited Seaver in New York in 1968, the All-Star hurler was working on a project for a USC geology course, collecting and analyzing dirt from every pitcher’s mound in the National League.
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Post by RickB on Sept 10, 2020 6:55:06 GMT -5
jamesp I know that you classify/screen your clay, but have you ever processed it like this. I water process my clay like some of the primitive potters do. Not only does this make great clay to make pots with and wood fire them, but it works great when I use it as slurry. Here's a good read. www.practicalprimitive.com/skillofthemonth/processingclay.html
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 10, 2020 7:21:14 GMT -5
Clay is an interesting resource. Pitcher mound clay comes from selected locations for it to qualify as official. But [Tom Seaver] never forgot the promise he made his father, Charles, and USC baseball coach Rod Dedeaux that he would get his college degree. When Grande visited Seaver in New York in 1968, the All-Star hurler was working on a project for a USC geology course, collecting and analyzing dirt from every pitcher’s mound in the National League.
Interesting. I did some research on mound clay. It is now allowed to be brewed and mixed to exacting specifications. The whole infield is custom mixed clay on pro fields. This is a big investment.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 10, 2020 7:49:29 GMT -5
jamesp I know that you classify/screen your clay, but have you ever processed it like this. I water process my clay like some of the primitive potters do. Not only does this make great clay to make pots with and wood fire them, but it works great when I use it as slurry. Here's a good read. www.practicalprimitive.com/skillofthemonth/processingclay.html Interesting Rick. This process is a small scale particle separation as done by the high tech kaolin processors in central South Carolina and Georgia. This is the way to get the unwanted particles like sand separated from the clay ! The big operations use vast settling ponds. And mechanical separators. Centrifuges. And a plethora of other heavy processing machines. Mind you they ship the final purified clay in rail cars due to the massive production rates. So far I have only used clay for step 1. So it doesn't matter if sand and small pieces of quartz are mixed in. This Kaolin Pectate liquid is the first time I have had access to highly screened classified clay. It answered questions about using clay for the polish operation. I believe potters process the clay to highly pure, then add sand and other materials in measured amounts to get a perfect blend for pottery. Native man must have done the same thing being we find there pottery shards to this day. Certainly durable. What do you think about the purity of this clay from a settlement pond at a construction site ? I should perform the process you linked to see if there is any sand settling out in these settlement slabs. The unofficial catchment pond was about 3 feet deep in muddy runoff water before it dried out. I carried several hundred pounds of this home. I must use this in smaller doses because of the high clay content to avoid over thickening the slurry.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 10, 2020 7:56:31 GMT -5
Lots of clay from some large dried lake bed. Probably a good slurry candidate.
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Post by RickB on Sept 10, 2020 8:40:22 GMT -5
"What do you think about the purity of this clay from a settlement pond at a construction site ? I should perform the process you linked to see if there is any sand settling out in these settlement slabs. The unofficial catchment pond was about 3 feet deep in muddy runoff water before it dried out. I carried several hundred pounds of this home."
James, that's great clay to start with. Further processing it sounds like a good plan. You'll be able to filter/settle out any sand that may be in there as I know that there will be some. The clay I get after processing is very very fine. The test for fineness/plasticity is to roll out a coil about the thickness of your little finger and then wrapping it around one of your fingers. If it cracks, it needs further refinement. To make pottery, grit is then added to temper and keep the pottery together.
I've gotten really nice looking clay out of crystal pockets before and processed it the same way.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 10, 2020 8:57:09 GMT -5
"What do you think about the purity of this clay from a settlement pond at a construction site ? I should perform the process you linked to see if there is any sand settling out in these settlement slabs. The unofficial catchment pond was about 3 feet deep in muddy runoff water before it dried out. I carried several hundred pounds of this home."James, that's great clay to start with. Further processing it sounds like a good plan. You'll be able to filter/settle out any sand that may be in there as I know that there should be some. The clay I get after processing is very very fine. The test for fineness/plasticity is to roll out a coil about the thickness of your little finger and then wrapping it around one of your fingers. If it cracks, it needs further refinement. To make pottery, grit is then added to temper and keep the pottery together. I've gotten really nice looking clay out of crystal pockets before and processed it the same way. My childhood buddy's family were potters from south Alabama for 5 generations. Mrs. Vick (his Mom) had collected the best of the best. Her collection was incredible. She passed and I helped Steve find a buyer for her collection. Steve and his brother received a substantial sum of money from the sale, had no idea the value. They were about to toss the whole collection in a dumpster when cleaning out her house !! Our rivers are all muddy thanks to the clay in our soil. Our rivers are rated by their pollution content based on the amount of particulate clay in the water. Most pass metals and chemical pollutants. Most are in bad shape by EPA standards. Mountain and coastal areas are rocky or sandy with clear water. They don't have to be so concerned about clay settling out of the water and choking out entire wetland forests and stream bank vegetation leading to serious erosion.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 10, 2020 10:48:52 GMT -5
FINAL RESULTS - on processed clay slurry(Kaolin Pectate 4 solution) with AO 14,000. Test run in a dual sided hopper on a Vibrasonic vibe. Each side isolated from the other. With AO 14,000 Rock Shed polish for 10 hours with k pectate 4. Rip shine Without AO 14,000, just k pectate 4 with no abrasives/polish added. failure Complaint - Prefer a powder instead of a liquid. A powder can be added to thicken slurry. The polish slurry was way to wet because the rocks were just washed and were wet at start. Surprised it did not frost the larger rocks. This is my HEAVY dual sided home made hopper that does glass so well. Hopper at 12.5 pounds, holding capacity 8 pounds. This heavy hopper was a game changer for delicate materials and does Mohs 7 very efficiently also. It lowered vibration amplitude substantially.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 10, 2020 11:05:18 GMT -5
Kaolin can be had very cheap. It is just a matter of finding a source that is silica free for polish operations. Florida kaolin probably has a better chance of being silica free. May order some of this kaolin for a go. Cheap. May be silica free straight out of deposit as dug, it happens. pizzano, compare to Miser @ $20/50 pounds..let me test it first. She is sending a broken bag.
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Post by Mel on Sept 11, 2020 9:54:41 GMT -5
"I drive 3/4 mile on an ATV to a clay vein exposed by a logging road. " jamesp - I really wonder if anything you do would surprise me It's a source of amusement to me that pottery shops use SiC in their glazes, and kaolin in their greenware/clay, but when I call them wanting 50-60 pounds of each? Well then they think I'm nuts. However they're the ones cooking dirt all day long...
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2020 10:26:18 GMT -5
The next step will be using an el cheapo powdered kaolin. Then the next step will be using an el cheapo powdered kaolin on glass. In my experience a fast pre and polish finish means efficient lubrication, abrasive distribution and surface protection. A slurry is the only way to accomplish all three of these requirements. Smalls greatly help with protection, little help with lubrication, and some help with abrasive distribution. Smalls are also needed to balance range of sizes. A slurry can not replace the function of smalls. Another note about slick sticky slurry is how it scavenges and breaks down the entire dose of abrasives for each step. Abrasives that did not get broken down can leave scratches on the batch that the next finer abrasives may not remove. Lubrication is complex. It is well known that lubrication is critical to many machining and abrading processes. Abrading rocks of many chemical compositions greatly increases the complexity of abrasion due to chemical reactions. Abrading a known metal with known abrasives is a simple situation since all chemical compounds are known. Resulting chemical reactions can be predicted. 'Books' or sheets, kaolin particles under magnification. Mohs hardness 2 - 2.5. Because it is in thin sheet form it can leave a very thin coating so it is used in paint and paper coatings. Known for being extremely slick. But it's best attribute is staying in suspension in liquid.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Sept 11, 2020 10:47:11 GMT -5
"I drive 3/4 mile on an ATV to a clay vein exposed by a logging road. " jamesp - I really wonder if anything you do would surprise me It's a source of amusement to me that pottery shops use SiC in their glazes, and kaolin in their greenware/clay, but when I call them wanting 50-60 pounds of each? Well then they think I'm nuts. However they're the ones cooking dirt all day long... The paint and paper uses quite a bit of kaolin clay. They call us the white gold belt in Georgia. This stuff brings money in like oil. I noticed the use of SiC in pottery. China clay is made almost exclusively from kaolin. And it has like 90% composition aluminum oxide. SiC and AO are ceramics. I believe all oxides used in abrasives(cerium, tin, etc) are classified as ceramics. Lots of ceramic engineering work is done here in Georgia because of our massive clay deposits. And us Georgia boys all used to get our ass's whooped by our Mama's for ruining our clothes playing in the clay. He he, you mentioned your soap... Clay pits are to this day used for recreation and skin bathing. Nothing like rubbing white clay all over your body and let it dry in the hot sun. It shrinks and squeezes your body. I always scored with dates taking them to the white kaolin pits with their Bahama water - rich turquoise colored hot ponds to swim in. Lunar landscape. High sun reflectivity. Huber Georgia - www.flickr.com/photos/67205364@N06/sets/72157664920443825It will be 120F in the bottom of a pit like this in the summer. The shape reflects the heat to the bottom.
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Post by orrum on Sept 11, 2020 20:05:26 GMT -5
Awesome sauce Jim!!!
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