rockhoundmn
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2020
Posts: 75
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Post by rockhoundmn on Nov 30, 2020 23:24:35 GMT -5
Hi! I'm grateful to have found this place and you all. I've gotten many great tips already and am just starting out. Actually, all I've done so far is collect rocks with the idea that I should use the short MN season of unfrozen ground to collect and the long winter for polishing. Problem is, I have way too many rocks. For a time, I was doing a quick sort as I went, returning the ones I knew I didn't want. A little back story - I broke my foot in May this year (missed the last step on a flight of stairs, in the dark) just as I was getting in the swing of rock hunting season. It was to be my first full season hunting rocks, having just discovered my passion the previous Fall. This eliminated a lot of hunting spots for me and I was devastated. Then something amazing happened. My boss happens to own an empty lot near my house, which was used last year as a loading point for our highway upgrade (concrete) so had layers of gravel installed. This gravel happened to have all the agates I could want! Far better than any of the other picked over spots I'd found so far. My boss gave me permission to take any rock, of any kind or size, in any quantity and then do what I wish with them. Challenge accepted. With a nice even ground covering the lot, I was able to pick that sucker all spring and summer. Even better was the constant movement of the gravel layers by heavy machinery installing a small boulevard and sidewalk nearby. After rain, I didnt even need to look for agates, they found me. The downside was that when they were not wet many were covered in mud, cement or dust and my job was hard. I needed a lot of water to see what I was picking, more than I could carry. I look back on that now as a great learning curve, noting my progress in finding rocks in "picked over" areas since. I seem to have learned a lot about other features to look out for rather than simply color or translucency. I relied a lot on texture and fracture patterns, weight and shape of stones etc.. of course this also meant I picked a lot of rocks to get a feel for what they are and what they aren't. I was for a time returning my discarded piles after rinsing to see the true attributes. And I'm grateful for that, because now I have half the collection of no doubt piles of "just rocks" with a few keepers thrown in! But I still have a huge pile and in a way I'm glad to have saved so many until the end of the season when I know a little more about which clues to look for, that a rock is worth "exploring" more. But these rocks...I've so far managed to toss out 3 of the five gallon buckets full. Pictured are the ones I have left. I have a new tile saw, Dremel (I thought I could use mainly for pre-shaping to shorten the length of rotary tumble time), new Thumler's Model B tumbler and Lot-O vibe for finishing. I'm all set. Here's the kicker - I have no idea where to start. Except maybe I thought I'd try to do some stuff with the Dremel first to get an idea of whether or not I really do understand hardness or am just imagining that I do. I've got a bunch of practice pieces of every different type of rock I've kept that I dont mind screwing up. I've tried to keep only rocks that I think will take a polish - agate, jasper, chalcedony, quartz, petrified wood - with some exceptions that I will keep as specimens. I'm so excited to get started! So ummm...where do I start? To be honest the sorting rocks is getting a little overwhelming especially since the recent weather has allowed even more collecting. I feel I've made done enough to make a start. These are the piles I haven't gone through yet, so they could contain pretty much anything. The buckets are 5 gallon and the plastic bags are 1 quart. The big blue tub, im not sure of capacity but I can say it used to have straight sides which are now bulging. There are also other piles I'm discovering in various spots but this is pretty much the lot. Thought I'd start with similar or same hardness rocks in the rotary tumbler. Have been picking out non agate pieces as I go (to practice on): A small sample of smaller sized agates I've found, in water:
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Post by manofglass on Nov 30, 2020 23:30:20 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum from Michigan
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Dec 1, 2020 9:16:14 GMT -5
Welcome from Northern Arizona!
Looks like you have some nice little lakers in that last picture. It's awesome that you can rockhound right next door.
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rockhoundmn
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2020
Posts: 75
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Post by rockhoundmn on Dec 1, 2020 14:38:12 GMT -5
Thanks for reading! I know my post is quite a read, but I figure whoever makes their way through and decides they can help, can really help me in particular. If that turns out to be nobody, then I will just be happy to keep researching. Maybe I'll stumble on a mentor or two that way.
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Post by rockjunquie on Dec 1, 2020 16:43:27 GMT -5
Thanks for reading! I know my post is quite a read, but I figure whoever makes their way through and decides they can help, can really help me in particular. If that turns out to be nobody, then I will just be happy to keep researching. Maybe I'll stumble on a mentor or two that way. Welcome!
BTW- I don't do much tumbling so I can't help, but we have some worldwide prize winners here who will find this.
Had to edit because I'm stupid. LOL!!!!!
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Post by jasoninsd on Dec 1, 2020 18:38:09 GMT -5
First, welcome to the forum from South Dakota. Second, that is one of the most amazing "introduction" posts I've seen in awhile! Great job on that! Third, you have a great collection of rocks for this summer's effort! Fourth, I'm tired of numbering! LOL There is no such thing as "too many" rocks on this forum...there's always room for one more! It's really cool you stumbled onto your own private hunting ground and it looks like it's going to be a great place to find treasures!. You've got a great start on your list of equipment! I have the same Thumler's Model B, so my recommendation for a starting point is to get 2/3 of that barrel full of rocks you think you don't want along with a few of the ones you think you do (similar hardness - similar, not exact). The reason I say to start there, is it's going to take a week, maybe two or three (or more) for those to reach the point of being ready to go into the vibe. Once those are done, it's also going to give you a better idea on what may or may not need to be dremeled or trimmed on the tile saw prior to going in the vibe. Of course, you could start with dremeling or trimming and then put those in the rotary...sometimes you can trim/dremel enough, they may not need the rotary and could go straight into the vibe in 120/220 grit. It depends on whether you want the stones rounded by the rotary, or whether you want the edges smoothed in the vibe...only you will know what you want out of the stones. Even if you only do a single week of rough tumbling in the rotary, you already have over a year's worth of rotary tumbling for a single Model B in just the pictures you've posted! Bottom line (in my opinion) on "where to start", either tackle some with the dremel and trim saw and then get those in the rotary, or just get a batch going in the rotary and see what happens with them - and then go from there. Again, loved reading the intro!
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quartz
Cave Dweller
breakin' rocks in the hot sun
Member since February 2010
Posts: 3,334
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Post by quartz on Dec 1, 2020 20:49:20 GMT -5
Welcome from Oregon. It looks like you have some good material to start out with, lucky to have it so easily available. The one thing I recommend is patience, patience, patience. It will take a while but there are lots of helper outers here on the forum. Good luck.
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Post by aDave on Dec 1, 2020 21:18:11 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum from Southern CA.
In my personal opinion, just grab rocks, throw them in a barrel, and start tumbling them. You've go so much material that you won't be hurt by some rocks going away because they're too soft. As your volume reduces, just add new rough. When rocks are ready to move on (to your liking), set them aside and then put them in the next stage. I've been known to pretty much tumble anything, and I never pre-ground rocks. I'll admit, I could have benefitted from that, but all I was left with was having to roll things longer for not doing that.
Don't overthink this for now. If you want to spend time testing hardness, then do so. Stay about 1-1.5 difference in the Mohs scale (I read this somewhere before) with all of the rocks you're tumbling, and you should be okay. Jaspers and agates around 7 or so should be your target. That's great material for a beginner and results are often good.
Don't feel bad about your over-burden of rocks. I've got more than I'll probably ever tumble in my lifetime for now. I've had my tumblers shut down for a while now, but when I ever did this stuff, I just grabbed rocks as I saw it. I never stressed too much about matching hardness, though I had a pretty good idea about what I had on-hand at any time.
Grab the stuff, run the stuff and go from there. The more you run rocks, the more you'll be able to realize what you might be able to get out of them (specific variety).
Good luck.
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rockhoundmn
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2020
Posts: 75
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Post by rockhoundmn on Dec 1, 2020 23:03:07 GMT -5
Thanks everyone! I appreciate the responses and got lots out of each one. I really feel like I should just go for it now and am totally comfortable doing just that, after reading all your replies. Can't thank you all enough!
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Post by Mel on Dec 2, 2020 15:06:03 GMT -5
Howdy from the prairies!
There is only one solution to your problem... bigger tumbler (note, this is my advice to just about any rock question).
You've got a heck of a nice start!! Looking forward to seeing some progress pics!
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Post by rmf on Dec 2, 2020 18:46:42 GMT -5
rockhoundmn In my opinion start with the best, most consistent rough to get a good result right out of the gate. Follow the store bought recipe that comes with the tumbler to get a feel for what you are doing. So what is your best stuff. Image 6 is mostly Lake Superior agates. they will allow you to see your results with a uniform product of hardness 7. Use one of those agates as your scratch test master until you can visually tell agates and jaspers. Fill the rest of the drum with the stuff that won't scratch from image 5. This is your first batch. Fill the drum about 75% full and do not be afraid to add some pea size pieces to fill up the gaps. Do not use the dremel on this first batch. Learn tumbling first then try the dremel. You can always retumble a stone. Using a dremel is an expensive way to shape rocks due to the burs and time. Be careful not to get the rocks too hot when you use the dremel and wear a dust mask you don't want silicosis. For really dirty rocks you can tumble for a day or 2 in coarse and then wash and sort. You have a great start and some really nice lakers. Have fun!
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Post by jasoninsd on Dec 2, 2020 21:15:29 GMT -5
Howdy from the prairies! There is only one solution to your problem... bigger tumbler (note, this is my advice to just about any rock question). You've got a heck of a nice start!! Looking forward to seeing some progress pics! Tumbler S...I think you should have made that plural! LOL
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rockhoundmn
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2020
Posts: 75
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Post by rockhoundmn on Dec 2, 2020 21:51:50 GMT -5
Hmmm more food for thought, thank you! My rotary tumbler hasn't arrived yet so I've only done a little messing around with the dremel.
I like the idea of starting with what I already have sorted and think I'll try that first.
The tumbler I really wanted was a little outta my price range (40lb Lortone) but I figure I can always add to my collection later. Just don't tell my husband, he's still processing the first splurge.. lol
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Post by jasoninsd on Dec 2, 2020 22:32:49 GMT -5
Hmmm more food for thought, thank you! My rotary tumbler hasn't arrived yet so I've only done a little messing around with the dremel. I like the idea of starting with what I already have sorted and think I'll try that first. The tumbler I really wanted was a little outta my price range (40lb Lortone) but I figure I can always add to my collection later. Just don't tell my husband, he's still processing the first splurge.. lol Just my $0.02...I think the 40lb tumbler is only good if you're going commercial with the tumbles. I think those of us "hobbyists" are better off with one, two, or three smaller barrel tumblers. Reason being, unless you've got a constant 40 pounds of the same material, you'll be waiting to use that tumbler until you collect (or buy) enough rough to get to the 40 pounds. If you have a couple rotary tumblers, you could be running different material in different stages. This is why I'm going to get another rotary... probably a Thumler's A-R2. That way I can have two six pound barrels running different types of rough, getting them ready for the vibe. Some will be done quicker than others, so it should keep the vibe fed. This along with my Model B (for running "bigger" stones) should have me set for the "production" line... Again, just my thoughts...
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rockhoundmn
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2020
Posts: 75
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Post by rockhoundmn on Dec 3, 2020 1:26:04 GMT -5
It's funny you say that, my next choice would be the same one. I like the idea of having the option to have one larger or two smaller barrels running too.
Edit: ah nope, I'm thinking of Lortone QT66
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Post by jasoninsd on Dec 3, 2020 1:32:09 GMT -5
It's funny you say that, my next choice would be the same one. I like the idea of having the option to have one larger or two smaller barrels running too. Edit: ah nope, I'm thinking of Lortone QT66 I know a lot of people on the forum have that Lortone...so you might have an easier time following a lot of people's recipes and advice. It's a great choice too! Remember...we expect to see progress pics.
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rockhoundmn
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2020
Posts: 75
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Post by rockhoundmn on Dec 3, 2020 1:36:00 GMT -5
Oh I am gonna have so many pics...!
Thanks Jason and I forgot to add earlier - good point about the 40lb. I would have no trouble keeping it running during warmer months but may come up short during winter.
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Post by jasoninsd on Dec 3, 2020 1:42:51 GMT -5
Oh I am gonna have so many pics...! Thanks Jason and I forgot to add earlier - good point about the 40lb. I would have no trouble keeping it running during warmer months but may come up short during winter. I've still been running mine in the garage as we've lucked out the last couple months with warmer than usual weather. However, I have about a week to figure out how to dampen the sound when they go inside. LOL We usually get the same type of cold over here in SD as you...I'm on the western edge of SD.
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Post by stephan on Dec 3, 2020 2:07:43 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum from NorCal. I’m not a tumbler, but you’ll get plenty of advice from folks here. Looks like you have some nice finds.
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Post by Mel on Dec 3, 2020 9:19:36 GMT -5
Hmmm more food for thought, thank you! My rotary tumbler hasn't arrived yet so I've only done a little messing around with the dremel. I like the idea of starting with what I already have sorted and think I'll try that first. The tumbler I really wanted was a little outta my price range (40lb Lortone) but I figure I can always add to my collection later. Just don't tell my husband, he's still processing the first splurge.. lol Just my $0.02...I think the 40lb tumbler is only good if you're going commercial with the tumbles. I think those of us "hobbyists" are better off with one, two, or three smaller barrel tumblers. Reason being, unless you've got a constant 40 pounds of the same material, you'll be waiting to use that tumbler until you collect (or buy) enough rough to get to the 40 pounds. If you have a couple rotary tumblers, you could be running different material in different stages. This is why I'm going to get another rotary... probably a Thumler's A-R2. That way I can have two six pound barrels running different types of rough, getting them ready for the vibe. Some will be done quicker than others, so it should keep the vibe fed. This along with my Model B (for running "bigger" stones) should have me set for the "production" line... Again, just my thoughts... I love big tumblers, but definitely go QT66/12 (buy the 66 first, 2x66 barrels is more expensive than 1x12 barrel and they can be swapped on the same chassis) rather than the big boys. You need a LOT to fill those 44 pound machines and once you're caught up on your backlog, it'll be hell to fill it up. A smaller machine will serve you well (both in savings on filler & grit). Also remember "size" means "weight of barrel + rocks + water + grit", not "12 pounds of rock + water". I go a bit over on mine (around 14-15lbs) but not over that. Don't want to replace motors or belts. Just my $0.02. And jasoninsd - Well of course tumblerS, because she'll already have one but new rock people tend to leave them alone unsupervised.....and tumblers somehow reproduce
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