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Post by jasoninsd on Mar 28, 2022 20:43:16 GMT -5
"Jase and Jim" - Giant killers for hire! LOL I have looked at many items and know I would give my left kidney to know the true story of their existence. (Easy to say since it can't happen! LOL) We could do Black Sabbath's Iron Man video(you best get a younger partner lol). I agree, what the heck were those guys like back then ? I ask - would I approach them or sneak around them ? Friend or Foe ?...Food or friend (yikes) Fear. Being scared. That's what I think the main emotion was of many of the "people" back then. Either that or anger. I don't think "happiness" or "contentedness" was all too common.
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RWA3006
Cave Dweller
Member since March 2009
Posts: 4,125
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Post by RWA3006 on Mar 28, 2022 21:10:34 GMT -5
James, that's a great find. I notice a sort of flute at the base which makes me think it was hafted, but I don't know.
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Sabre52
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Me and my gal, Rosie
Member since August 2005
Posts: 20,455
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Post by Sabre52 on Mar 28, 2022 21:34:00 GMT -5
Man, that is one big heavy looking projectile point! Does look like a good candidate for a heavy lance tip. Was in a cafe in SE Oregon one time and a fellow had a leather bag full of lance tips that were large and heavy. Found them in a small cave full of woodrat nests. Each was still bound to a short hardwood shaft about a foot long and conical at the end away from the point. The theory being that the fore ends were socketed into a heavy lance pole. When the point was thrust into a big game animal, the fore end pulled out of the large pole and the stone point stayed in the prey and worked around to bleed the critter. The hunter then placed a new fore shaft with point into the lance pole and was ready to make another thrust into the target. Kind of like a repeating lance that could be used repetitively without losing the longer heavier pole in the animal. One can easily imagine such a weapon being used on big critters, even mammoths, ground sloths or ancient bison. One of the hafted points he had in the bag looked very like the tan lance point I posted in my Modoc artifact pic a while ago and the Modoc area is not far from SE Oregon.
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Post by rockpickerforever on Mar 28, 2022 23:20:08 GMT -5
Looks like a keeper to me!! Thanks for all the pictures. It’s so fun to find something made by someone practically from another world. This one might be from another planet Pat ! Ha. Sure wish I knew what it was used for. Hey, I want to wish you a Happy Belated Birthday, I just remembered I forgot about you. Jean normally reminds me because I often have my brain displaced no telling where else. Yeah, blame me, James. It is all my fault. I should have tipped you off. jk. Just been busy with Bob's health issues, has a mole on his back diagnosed as invasive melanoma. Brought this to his dermatologist's attention 15 months ago - nothing. It's still just a small mole, but in the elapsed time, the melanoma has gone into three lymph nodes in his arm pits. He just had a nuclear scan today to determine that. He has surgery scheduled tomorrow, to remove the mole (invasive means they tend to grow deep, like a root), and also take out the three implicated lymph nodes. His surgeon is a plastic surgeon, so he can put Bob back together afterwards. All this on top of his other ongoing problems, like chronic anemia (caused by a GI bleed they can't find). He had an iron infusion last Wednesday, will have another on Friday. He is constantly having labs done to check his levels, his iron gets pretty low every few months, and he needs to go in and get topped up, lol. Won't even start on his heart problems... We just take it a day at a time.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Mar 29, 2022 3:22:08 GMT -5
This one might be from another planet Pat ! Ha. Sure wish I knew what it was used for. Hey, I want to wish you a Happy Belated Birthday, I just remembered I forgot about you. Jean normally reminds me because I often have my brain displaced no telling where else. Yeah, blame me, James. It is all my fault. I should have tipped you off. jk. Just been busy with Bob's health issues, has a mole on his back diagnosed as invasive melanoma. Brought this to his dermatologist's attention 15 months ago - nothing. It's still just a small mole, but in the elapsed time, the melanoma has gone into three lymph nodes in his arm pits. He just had a nuclear scan today to determine that. He has surgery scheduled tomorrow, to remove the mole (invasive means they tend to grow deep, like a root), and also take out the three implicated lymph nodes. His surgeon is a plastic surgeon, so he can put Bob back together afterwards. All this on top of his other ongoing problems, like chronic anemia (caused by a GI bleed they can't find). He had an iron infusion last Wednesday, will have another on Friday. He is constantly having labs done to check his levels, his iron gets pretty low every few months, and he needs to go in and get topped up, lol. Won't even start on his heart problems... We just take it a day at a time. Oh Jean so sorry to hear this. I hope the doctor was responsible. Some of those skin cancers can be super quick acting and must be monitored constantly. A nagging and persistent situation at best. Us old guys don't often take care of ourselves like we should. you have mentioned Bob's health issues for a long time running. I see my friends our age suffering more and more with their health issues and I wrestle with a few of my own. This getting old is certainly not easy. Thought and prayers
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Mar 29, 2022 3:35:01 GMT -5
We could do Black Sabbath's Iron Man video(you best get a younger partner lol). I agree, what the heck were those guys like back then ? I ask - would I approach them or sneak around them ? Friend or Foe ?...Food or friend (yikes) Fear. Being scared. That's what I think the main emotion was of many of the "people" back then. Either that or anger. I don't think "happiness" or "contentedness" was all too common. Concern for self preservation would certainly be on high alert Jason. What if the ladies were in tiny leather bikinis and really hot ? That might be a really dangerous situation !
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Mar 29, 2022 3:40:58 GMT -5
James, that's a great find. I notice a sort of flute at the base which makes me think it was hafted, but I don't know. It sure would be interesting to be a fly on the wall during unrecorded history Randy. Half the fun in collecting ancient artifacts be it dino poop, fossils, points, etc is the imagination it provokes. Those guys had to find artifacts too. Add fossils to that. They were subject to the same curiosity pains that we are subjected to.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Mar 29, 2022 4:19:17 GMT -5
Man, that is one big heavy looking projectile point! Does look like a good candidate for a heavy lance tip. Was in a cafe in SE Oregon one time and a fellow had a leather bag full of lance tips that were large and heavy. Found them in a small cave full of woodrat nests. Each was still bound to a short hardwood shaft about a foot long and conical at the end away from the point. The theory being that the fore ends were socketed into a heavy lance pole. When the point was thrust into a big game animal, the fore end pulled out of the large pole and the stone point stayed in the prey and worked around to bleed the critter. The hunter then placed a new fore shaft with point into the lance pole and was ready to make another thrust into the target. Kind of like a repeating lance that could be used repetitively without losing the longer heavier pole in the animal. One can easily imagine such a weapon being used on big critters, even mammoths, ground sloths or ancient bison. One of the hafted points he had in the bag looked very like the tan lance point I posted in my Modoc artifact pic a while ago and the Modoc area is not far from SE Oregon. That is amazing Mel. But of no surprise. Feel free to post that tan lance point, it would be appropriate for this thread. That technology is similar to modern broadhead systems. The animal cuts himself when on the move with a razor broadhead stuck in him. The arrow is more effective stuck in it than passing thru. Those folks were just as brilliant as we are, they are humans and perfectly capable of such designs. Any artifact dating back to the ice age has special merit. It was like another world and man was certainly lower on the food chain. The fluted Paleo points are so rare. My experience anyway, only one true fluted point in many finds. Make sense, population had to be much smaller back then. Hard to know what age this piece might be. Ice age Florida caused the water table to drop turning the river bottoms into small creeks. Paleo era camps were built along the creek, basically the present day river bottom. These rivers have a large amount of Paleo pints. I rarely find artifacts in creek and river bottoms here in the rocky piedmont. Unless the river is flowing thru sand where rocks are rare is it easier to find them. This piece has many tiny knicks on the edge that are not water polished. It has likely travelled a good ways downstream. The gravel is small on this river which may have helped preserve it from damage during floods. Other people in this coastal plain section in south Alabama collect in creeks successfully. This gravel bar was at a section of the river with flat land for the upstream 2 to 3 miles, above that it was flowing thru hill country. That may have a bearing on artifact density since their camps were typically on flat fields, don't know. No till farming has greatly reduced erosion into the rivers and has to limit artifact dumps to some degree. Disced fields are now a thing of the past. It is hard to find erosion ditches always present in the valleys of farmer's fields that had been plowed. As you well know erosion is key to finding artifacts. May head down again today if I can get some more shut eye. Curse of the sleeplessness. It's 150 miles each way. Need to take kayak to get to adjacent river bars. Or might bring a big trash bag to get into and make a redneck crossing
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Post by rockjunquie on Mar 29, 2022 6:36:23 GMT -5
Hot damn! I don't know what impresses me more- that awesome gigantic point or the 'Yota pulling out of that hole! Surprised to see how clean that white truck was. rockpickerforever Sorry about Bob. Damn doctors. Shoulda taken care of it when it was easier to do. I hope they get it all.
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Post by jasoninsd on Mar 29, 2022 7:33:11 GMT -5
Fear. Being scared. That's what I think the main emotion was of many of the "people" back then. Either that or anger. I don't think "happiness" or "contentedness" was all too common. Concern for self preservation would certainly be on high alert Jason. What if the ladies were in tiny leather bikinis and really hot ? That might be a really dangerous situation ! This movie immediately came to mind! LOL There's even a clip for Randy - RWA3006
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Post by rockpickerforever on Mar 29, 2022 9:19:43 GMT -5
Yeah, blame me, James. It is all my fault. I should have tipped you off. jk. Just been busy with Bob's health issues, has a mole on his back diagnosed as invasive melanoma. Brought this to his dermatologist's attention 15 months ago - nothing. It's still just a small mole, but in the elapsed time, the melanoma has gone into three lymph nodes in his arm pits. He just had a nuclear scan today to determine that. He has surgery scheduled tomorrow, to remove the mole (invasive means they tend to grow deep, like a root), and also take out the three implicated lymph nodes. His surgeon is a plastic surgeon, so he can put Bob back together afterwards. All this on top of his other ongoing problems, like chronic anemia (caused by a GI bleed they can't find). He had an iron infusion last Wednesday, will have another on Friday. He is constantly having labs done to check his levels, his iron gets pretty low every few months, and he needs to go in and get topped up, lol. Won't even start on his heart problems... We just take it a day at a time. Oh Jean so sorry to hear this. I hope the doctor was responsible. Some of those skin cancers can be super quick acting and must be monitored constantly. A nagging and persistent situation at best. Us old guys don't often take care of ourselves like we should. you have mentioned Bob's health issues for a long time running. I see my friends our age suffering more and more with their health issues and I wrestle with a few of my own. This getting old is certainly not easy. Thought and prayers Thank you, James, will gladly accept any thoughts and thoughts and prayers. Will know more later today on the melanoma prognosis. He is actually feeling better todsy after the iron infusion last week.
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Post by rockpickerforever on Mar 29, 2022 9:22:02 GMT -5
Hot damn! I don't know what impresses me more- that awesome gigantic point or the 'Yota pulling out of that hole! Surprised to see how clean that white truck was. rockpickerforever Sorry about Bob. Damn doctors. Shoulda taken care of it when it was easier to do. I hope they get it all. Thanks, Tela. I do blame the doctors for their inattention. So typical these days.
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Mar 29, 2022 9:43:32 GMT -5
Oh Jean so sorry to hear this. I hope the doctor was responsible. Some of those skin cancers can be super quick acting and must be monitored constantly. A nagging and persistent situation at best. Us old guys don't often take care of ourselves like we should. you have mentioned Bob's health issues for a long time running. I see my friends our age suffering more and more with their health issues and I wrestle with a few of my own. This getting old is certainly not easy. Thought and prayers Thank you, James, will gladly accept any thoughts and thoughts and prayers. Will know more later today on the melanoma prognosis. He is actually feeling better todsy after the iron infusion last week. You've got them, Jean!
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Post by Pat on Mar 29, 2022 11:14:46 GMT -5
jamesp and rockpickerforever Thanks for the happy birthday; it's always welcome. Jean, we are going through the same things and others here, too. James, hang in there! Growing old is not for wimps, said our older friend. She died at 96. Us young 'uns (70s and 80s) took her out to lunch monthly until she could no longer go out. We miss her.
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Sabre52
Cave Dweller
Me and my gal, Rosie
Member since August 2005
Posts: 20,455
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Post by Sabre52 on Mar 29, 2022 15:08:47 GMT -5
James: the big tan lance point is in the middle of the pic of the Modoc area group I posted on Feb 23. Kind of similar to a Scott's Bluff. Material must have been imported as most Modoc artifacts are obsidian. Closest jasper, agate and pet wood seems to be from NE of where this was found.
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Post by beefjello on Mar 29, 2022 19:27:33 GMT -5
Damn that's a beaut James!!
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Post by liveoak on Mar 30, 2022 6:27:40 GMT -5
WOW Jim, congrats on a great find. Certainly making all your driving & scouting worth it.
I think you're pushing Tom & I to get exploring in Alabama
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Post by rockpickerforever on Mar 30, 2022 7:51:05 GMT -5
Hot damn! I don't know what impresses me more- that awesome gigantic point or the 'Yota pulling out of that hole! Surprised to see how clean that white truck was. rockpickerforever Sorry about Bob. Damn doctors. Shoulda taken care of it when it was easier to do. I hope they get it all. Thanks, Tela. I do blame the doctors for their inattention. So typical these days. A quick update on Bob - Yesterday, his doctor removed three lymph nodes and the melanoma. The surgery went well. He had to go pretty deep to remove the melanoma (a very large, ugly wound), but he was very optimistic that he got it all, and nothing further would need to be done. Of course, we still need to wait and see what the pathology report says. We will also be in touch with Oncology, just in case, and keep a close watch on it. Can never be too careful with these things.
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Post by hummingbirdstones on Mar 30, 2022 9:13:56 GMT -5
Thanks, Tela. I do blame the doctors for their inattention. So typical these days. A quick update on Bob - Yesterday, his doctor removed three lymph nodes and the melanoma. The surgery went well. He had to go pretty deep to remove the melanoma (a very large, ugly wound), but he was very optimistic that he got it all, and nothing further would need to be done. Of course, we still need to wait and see what the pathology report says. We will also be in touch with Oncology, just in case, and keep a close watch on it. Can never be too careful with these things. That is good news, Jean. Continued prayers for a full recovery for Bob and no other issues.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,154
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Post by jamesp on Mar 30, 2022 9:19:38 GMT -5
Great news rockpickerforever. Bet you guys are relieved. jasoninsd Curious if Ringo Starr remembers this performance. ROFL, Hollywood did well stimulating the imagination. Did those attractive cave girls have anything to do with why we are called Homosapien Erectus ? Those Modec points are fine Sabre52. My favorite was the Scottsbluff look alike of pet wood. Fine knapping on the whole batch. Each year that goes by health issues keep hinting at their control over us Pat. When are they going to invent that time machine ! Glad you like that monster slayer beefjello. Those big ones are few and far. Check out Chewacla Creek liveoak. It's gravel bars(and other creeks east) can be seen on GE imagery. Just that 7 mile stretch has enough bars to take 100's if not 1000's of hours to inspect. It and it's tributaries and other creeks due east have gouged out the quartzite layer in that area. The water is clean, slightly yellowed and a pleasure to kayak. Scenery nice. Most of these creeks are fast flowing.
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