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Post by Bejewelme on Mar 19, 2009 22:36:39 GMT -5
Usually when someone sends me slabs I try and do a good job with them, but I don't know I am not overwhelmed with any of these It seems like I CONTINUALLY have more scratches, and I am wondering if the old man's refurbished wheels didn't yield nicer looking cabs?? I think I was happier with the old wheels. How long does it take to break in the Nova wheels? I still must find a dop that works, the superglue w/accelerator isn't working, bigger dowels aren't working, I think cabbing with my fingers isn't working...and it is really hard to use the buffing end plate with my fingers!!! Although maybe it is operator error, I have been sick all week and thought that cabbing would make me feel better! But after all this frustration, here they are, not my best!!! These slabs were from HPD, so I was really trying with these!!! Bruneau Crazy Lace Owyee I tried to make an oval!! Thanks HPD!!! I will try and do better next time!!! Carnelian- a broken piece due to USPS from Woodyrock, I liked they druzy top, I thought Lori might like this to wrap into a flower bud, it sort of reminded me of a rose. I loved my box from Woody and told him I wasn't going to waste one broken piece of anything! Ocean Jasper-from the yellow slice, this is the green part, my son liked this one!!! Said it looks like a sea monster! Fancy Bloodstone-Naturenut got me a piece of Harry Z's fancy bloodstone this one is for her. Thanks Jo! Amethyst-cause Jo has been wanting some, this was all I had, but I did find one more piece of chevron, so we will see how that gets. Local PA Serpentine-Naturenut collected this, so this is for her! Local Rose Quartz- Also for naturenut, collected by her! I am loading her up for the long trip in the RV, so she can keep wrapping! Any suggestions are welcome, I am pretty frustrated! Thanks Amber :help:
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adrian65
Cave Dweller
Arch to golden memories and to great friends.
Member since February 2007
Posts: 10,777
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Post by adrian65 on Mar 19, 2009 23:10:03 GMT -5
Amber, it happens from times to times. Don't be angry and keep it fun. Besides, you got some beautiful pieces there. I'd say the bloodstone is perfectly done and what a shine on it! The Bruneau in the first pic is also beautiful but I think it deserves a redo, in order to elliminate the crumbly area in the right side. The craters and pits in the materials could also be the cause of some scratches. Sellect only good areas from the slabs or, if you really go for a nice pattern into a pitted area, fill them whith super glue after shaping the dome. This way not only the craters will be hidden, but you will also avoid the carrying of small grains from the craters during the polish process. The oval has in my opinion a good shape, it looks worst only because it's not pictured vertically. Try to rotate the picture or look at it rotating your head and you'll see.
Adrian
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mossyrockhound
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since January 2011
Posts: 1,278
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Post by mossyrockhound on Mar 19, 2009 23:27:01 GMT -5
Amber, I used super glue for awhile for dopping because my cabs were coming loose from the dopstick with dopping wax. Not long after that, I lost some that were super glued, so I went back to using dop wax. I concluded that my dop wax hadn't been hot enough and cabs weren't warm enough before, so I switched to a stainless steel measuring cup and heated the dop wax up on the stove burner. I layed the cabs on the cup handle (which stuck out a little way from the burner) while the wax was melting, so it got warmed up just right by the time the wax was starting to bubble. The only cab I've lost since doing this is one I had out in the cold shop (38 degrees) too long, because the shop acted just like the refrigerator does when you go to take the cab off the dop stick.
As far as the scratches go, I second Adrian's advice. Most of your stones look awesome though!
My two favorites are the carnelian/druzy and the fancy bloodstone. Keep up the good work!
Garry
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Post by stonesthatrock on Mar 19, 2009 23:27:39 GMT -5
ok now your sounding like ralph. he gave up. i'm trying to talk him into trying it again. I have to agree the adrain, sometimes it the materail, not the operator. I think they all look pretty good from here. i love the tulip. take a couple deep breathes and don't be so hard on yourself.
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highplainsdrifter
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2008
Posts: 1,266
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Post by highplainsdrifter on Mar 19, 2009 23:29:04 GMT -5
Scratches are my nemesis too. I spend most of my cabbing time trying to remove them. It looks like your scratches are right at the top/crown of the dome and are from your shaping wheels. This is a real hard area to get the scratches out, especially for lower angle tops. For mine, I use the left/right side of the wheel and push the top in, this allows the pressure to hit squarely on the top. When you use the center of the wheel for flatter tops, the shoulders of the cab take most of the pressure and the wheel isn't working well on the top. I'll take a pic tomorrow.
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Post by Woodyrock on Mar 20, 2009 1:20:19 GMT -5
Amber: I have been dopping with super glue, and have only had a couple off, and then only in polish when I have gotten the stone too hot, which softens the glue. I do wipe the stone with acetone to get the oil residue off before glueing the stick on. The only 'problem' I have really had with the super glue is getting the stone off even though I use unbonder if it does not just pop off. Oh, before, I forget, the cabs are beautiful!! Woody
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Post by rockmanken on Mar 20, 2009 6:27:00 GMT -5
Amber, don't get discouraged. They look great. All I can add to what has been said is I use dop wax. Used less than a stick in over 2 years now. I reuse mine and DON'T let the wax get too hot. The varnish will evaporate out and weaken it. I warm my stones on the side of the pot and as soon as the wax melts I dop them. I have a few come off, but it is still cold and I use cold water. NEVER have any come off in the summer. Sometimes it is operator error when they come off. I have also found that you need to let the dop cool off naturally. If you dip hot dop in cold water it seems to come off too soon. Ken
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Post by Bejewelme on Mar 20, 2009 6:33:02 GMT -5
Adrian-you crack me up!!! I ordered a bunch of stands from the rock shed, but they were too big for the cabs, so I prop them with a rock behind them, and they always seem to tilt!!! Sorry! Many of these are going back to the wheels, that unknown oval from HPD is a beautiful stone, I really want to fix that one, and the bruneau. I had a rainbow obsidian that is just beautiful and on the last wheel I could not believe the scratches!! I know my 80 grit wheel is really rough, it is probably more like a 60, and my second wheel is 280 and I spend forever on that wheel trying to get the scratches out, and it just seems like they are so deep!!! And then I don't see them again until the last wheel, and I am so mad! And I think some of these stones really hold the water, even though I am really drying them and looking with 3x mag glasses I put superglue on the lace and OJ, but it seems like it just gets eaten right off on the wheels. Tony is coming Saturday and I really need a lesson with him, unfortunately it seems we never cab together any more, since we always have something going on. Maybe he can straighten me out, because I am really frustrated. I was having trouble with scratches on the edges, and now all these are on the domes ughghghghghg!! The dopping is an ongoing problem, some are on so tight I can barely get them off, but most pop right off even after letting them sit for a day before I start! I clean them with acetone, or rubbing alcohol, and then the acc, then the glue. I will work on these next week and see if I can straighten some things out. Another question about the Genie. Do you dump the water between each wheel? I hate the water bubblers, you figure all that rock snot is getting on each wheel, and is it possible there is contamination from that? I liked the overhead valves on Tony's machine much better. Thanks everyone, I knew you guys would fix me up!!
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Post by NatureNut on Mar 20, 2009 6:54:52 GMT -5
Boy, do they look great! Yeah, a couple of scratches, but the shine and the detail are killer! You're too good to me! Jo
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Post by Tweetiepy on Mar 20, 2009 7:22:29 GMT -5
Boy I hate scratches - YOu think they look okay and then take a picture and they just SCREAM at you!
Don't get discouraged, I know I just get so gung-ho to move them on to the next grit (I have to change belts all the time) so the scratches just stay there but get a nice shiny coat all over the rest that says "Hey look how shiny I could have been if you'd just have grinded those scratches out properly!" I hate it when they say that to me!
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free4rms
freely admits to licking rocks
My little pet walrus
Member since January 2007
Posts: 839
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Post by free4rms on Mar 20, 2009 7:28:55 GMT -5
In my honest opinion, most of the cabs have a good polish. Here are a couple of thoughts, though. You said you really work the daylights out of the 280, but don't forget that when you are on the 600 and later polishing wheels to take your time on these. It is easy to get in a hurry on the later wheels, but a little extra time will sometimes really make a difference. And remember not to use too much pressure on the polishing wheels... let the diamonds do the work. As far as getting a good polish on the center of the domes, on the nova wheels you can hold the cab at a slight angle to the extreme outer edge of the novas and let the edge sweep across the face of the cab. I have used this technique on well over a thousand cabs and this works just great. If you want some photos on how this is done, just pm me and I will attach some photos to a reply. I also think you are being a bit too hard on yourself. The fact that most of your cabs have a good polish shows that you are on the right track.
Vance
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Post by sitnwrap on Mar 20, 2009 8:09:41 GMT -5
Amber, those are beauties and I wont say I don't see some scratches on a couple but the shine you gave them outshines them Ha, I noticed that most of these cabs you have done are going to your friends maybe that is why you are so hard on yourself. I love them all. The Carnelian is gorgeous and I may be a little quirky but I love the Crazy Lace also including the pits. Actually, it is the pits that draw me cause I bet if you look at it under a loupe there may be teeny crystals. ;D I'll make up some different size cab stands for ya. I can do it lickity split with some silver scrap wire if you want
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Post by Tonyterner on Mar 20, 2009 8:36:35 GMT -5
You are being waaaayyyyy too hard on yourself. Yes a couple of these look like they have scratches but the camera makes things look way worse than your eyes. I understand what HPD and Free4rms are saying about using the edge of the wheel so I will show you that tomorrow. I struggle with scratches at the top of flat domes too. Sometimes I just don't get a curve that goes all the way to the center and this makes it difficult to get the scratches out. Don't worry we will get it all figured out. Dopping on the other hand is another matter. I've using wax with much bigger diameter dowels and trying to get a big glob of wax to cover the entire back of the cab. I only dop when I am using cerium though so my results won't be the same as yours.
Overall I think these are some great cabs. That bloodstone is super and the material looks much nicer than I thought it was when I cut it. That carnelian is stunning too, nice freeform shape. Actually I like a lot of your shapes and your oval looks really good.
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highplainsdrifter
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2008
Posts: 1,266
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Post by highplainsdrifter on Mar 20, 2009 8:50:15 GMT -5
Another question about the Genie. Do you dump the water between each wheel? I hate the water bubblers, you figure all that rock snot is getting on each wheel, and is it possible there is contamination from that? I've seen contamination from dirty pans, but only when I get to the polish wheels. I think the particles/grit from the sanding wheels is too heavy or just not large enough to affect sanding. I do clean my pans after each cabbing session. Before going to 1200 from 600, I scrub my pan with a toothbrush and switch to distilled water for polishing. For dopping, I'm still using my glue gun. If they pop off, I put a couple drops of superglue on the back of the cab and push the old glue (stil on the dop stick) on. This works for me. The challenge is removing the stuff. I've been using a razor blade.
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Post by frane on Mar 20, 2009 8:52:02 GMT -5
Amber, I think they are looking great and I can only second what others have said. I am still using the wax. I have noticed that if everything is cold when I start it on the grinder, I keep a finger on the stone and the other on the dop stick and just run around the edge of the stone kind of quickly. it seems to add enough heat to the stone and then they don't go flying off the stick. Just something I have noticed recently. When you do dop, let the wax heat up enough and keep the stones warm. there is one spot on my dop pot that is warmer than the others. I keep several up on top and just move them to that spot before I actually dop that stone so it is even warmer. let them sit after you dop them for several hours. I have found that really helps. I still loose one every now and then, but not very often. That bloodstone really looks nice and you got the chevron amethyst to come out and that always undercuts for me so you did good even though you didn't feel well. Fran
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Post by Titania on Mar 20, 2009 10:25:56 GMT -5
Amber, you're definitely being way too hard on yourself! I went through a similar phase when I had been cabbing a couple of months. It seemed that no matter what, I was missing scratches. I figured out that I was trying to rush things a bit. Also, yes, those new Nova wheels take some work to get broken in. If you're working softer materials, it'll take even longer. See if you can find some really hard agate or jasper to work for the next few cabs. Another little trick I use is to do all of my grinding up to 600 in batches. I then let the cabs dry completely (overnight) before moving on. When the cabs have dried naturally, I can see scratches that I just can't see when trying off mid-stream with a paper towel. I can then go back and do a little bit of a touch-up before moving on. I think this is a great batch, personally. Sure, a few could use a touch-up, but that's no biggie. I think the shape on your oval is perfect! And the shine on that bloodstone is blinding! My favorite is the Carnelian. What a great shine, and I love the unconventional shape! Don't be discouraged. *hugs*
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highplainsdrifter
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since December 2008
Posts: 1,266
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Post by highplainsdrifter on Mar 20, 2009 18:11:09 GMT -5
Here are some pics of how I get the scratches off the tops of flatter cabs. Sweep the cab and rotate at this angle with medium pressure Don't take the angle this far or it will groove out your cab.. I forgot to mention, keep the wheels really wet...
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Post by Bejewelme on Mar 20, 2009 22:17:00 GMT -5
Thank you HPD, and Vance, who PM'd me the exact same pictures!!! You guys use the same wheel set up's too!!! And you both make killer cabs! Also a big thanks to all the nice people who PM'd me today with great advice!!! You guys have helped me so much over the last five months, I am hoping month 6 is going to turn things around in the cab department!!! Amber
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Post by stoner on Mar 21, 2009 15:59:27 GMT -5
Your cabs look great Amber, frustrations are part of the learning curve.If the top of the dome isn't rounded, you'll never get the scratches out. This will become less of a problem with more experience. I don't use a loupe or dry off my cabs during the different stages. I use my finger to feel the dome of the cab, and, if I feel any flat spots, I know I need to spend more time removing the flats. Hang in there, you're doing great.
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Post by Tony W on Mar 22, 2009 16:03:15 GMT -5
Shoot, they all look very nice to me! You are doing very well. The little imperfections are from impatience, nothing more. Slow down and get with the rhythm Enjoy the journey as much as the destination....rock zen. T
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