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Post by snowmom on Jan 22, 2015 5:31:57 GMT -5
great information! I have been gifted with many forms of obsidian and have been afraid to try to polish it because of my lack of experience, thanks for the thread and all the info you have collected, Love it when it all comes together. On to the next challenge. loving the learning.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 6:05:04 GMT -5
Looks like you're getting it nailed down, that's a good thing. You've not tortured us, I call it educated, and that too, is a good thing. As far as you quitting experimenting, we all know that isn't going to happen. It is a slow going hobby to experiment with. It's like growing plants in different soils, fertilizers, light conditions, etc; it takes a long time to get results. It took 15 years to perfect water lilies to grow and bloom well in small manageable pots. No books on that subject, just proprietary information under competitor's lock and key. Those and other plant experiments have paid the bills for 25 years. Laughing, one day I found one of my competitors had snuck into my nursery looking thru my fertilizer inventory. I have 3 different blends that I blend together in certain proportions for best results. The blooming ingredient was stashed elsewhere. The next year he was growing giant water lilies that grew out of the pot and never bloomed. They were useless. The high potassium component for bloom production and root growth was the main component, he never saw that one. I had taken it out of the bags and stored it in 15 gallon screw top barrels and stashed it behind the nursery pots. Have had Dutch bulb companies, Home Depot Reps, competitors, entrepreneurs and many others visit to get info on growing methods. Without knowing the fertilizer mated to the clay soil they were shooting in the dark.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 6:13:59 GMT -5
great information! I have been gifted with many forms of obsidian and have been afraid to try to polish it because of my lack of experience, thanks for the thread and all the info you have collected, Love it when it all comes together. On to the next challenge. loving the learning. Thanks Deb Can't speak for your vibe, but mine sure likes sugar coated obsidian at the rate of one tablespoon/pound, in the polish stage anyway.
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Post by connrock on Jan 22, 2015 9:17:46 GMT -5
Different strokes for different folks! LOL How many times have we read and written here that what works for one doesn't always work for others,,,one "recipe" that has worked for years for some won't work for everyone. I know I'm guilty of trying to get you off of the sugar and I shouldn't have cuz it worked for you in the past and has come home to help you again! Hey,,,I'm a soap freak cuz that's what works for me! I think one thing a lot of people can learn from you is that if things go wrong,don't give up and keep trying cuz the answer is there,,,,somewhere! I'm VERY happy for you James! connrock
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 9:35:27 GMT -5
Different strokes for different folks! LOL How many times have we read and written here that what works for one doesn't always work for others,,,one "recipe" that has worked for years for some won't work for everyone. I know I'm guilty of trying to get you off of the sugar and I shouldn't have cuz it worked for you in the past and has come home to help you again! Hey,,,I'm a soap freak cuz that's what works for me! I think one thing a lot of people can learn from you is that if things go wrong,don't give up and keep trying cuz the answer is there,,,,somewhere! I'm VERY happy for you James! connrock The sugar thing was a great source of ridicule. Wife does it too. Ha, or gets mad when it's all gone. Soap is needed to clean the sugar off, then got to get the soap off. So it is a hassle, cause the sugar leaves spots big time. It all has to do with a thickener, like you said, whatever works for ya. Still have some haze from a poor 1000 finish(I think). Will see if the sugar gets rid of that in the earlier grits on the next batches. What is weird is there was little improvement this morning after 20 hours than at 3 hours. May have to run a long time for the grit to break down with that thick sugar slurry, if in fact it ever will. So I am going to do a clean out and run them in Linde AO 50,000 for a few hours to see if that improves them. Keep giving me crap though. It stimulates thought.
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Post by captbob on Jan 22, 2015 10:23:57 GMT -5
My compliments on finding this answer to your quest. Rest now Sire, for we await future adventures. I enjoy watching a dog chase its' tail... I shall miss that.
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tkvancil
fully equipped rock polisher
Member since September 2011
Posts: 1,546
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Post by tkvancil on Jan 22, 2015 11:55:19 GMT -5
In Krystee's obsidian tutorial borax is recommended. Much like your sugar it will thicken a slurry, and it breaks down into something that feels "oily". Seems like they both thicken and lubricate. I have always resisted the idea of using sugar but may have to try it. No killing plants like borax when dumped.
Still learning to use my vibe. Just completed my fourth run. This time I had a real shine out of pre-polish. First three runs I always kept my slurry "loose" adding enough water along the way to keep it thin and wet looking. This time I used less water and let the slurry stay closer to a batter like consistency. Thicker is better?
Kudos on figuring out what works for you. Read all those threads and learned along with you.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 12:30:56 GMT -5
In Krystee's obsidian tutorial borax is recommended. Much like your sugar it will thicken a slurry, and it breaks down into something that feels "oily". Seems like they both thicken and lubricate. I have always resisted the idea of using sugar but may have to try it. No killing plants like borax when dumped. Still learning to use my vibe. Just completed my fourth run. This time I had a real shine out of pre-polish. First three runs I always kept my slurry "loose" adding enough water along the way to keep it thin and wet looking. This time I used less water and let the slurry stay closer to a batter like consistency. Thicker is better? Kudos on figuring out what works for you. Read all those threads and learned along with you. There was two issues tk, one of them is it stopped the obsidian from vibrating against each other on the very smallest level, two, it allowed the vibe to be dialed to a fast speed which really hastened the process. As soon as I dialed that vibe to a 'fast' normal production speed probably similar to factory vibes and started dumping sugar in at tablespoon at a time you could hear no more rocks buzzing against each other. Instead of the hard filler drying and getting stuck to the walls they were walking the walls like on ice. I read that an oily batter texture actually sucks the rocks together and about eliminates the bouncing and converts it to a wiping motion. I did 4 loads of agate with straight water and had no problems, guess it takes the micro bouncing fine. As far as grit breakdown and thicker slurry I know nothing. I was surprised that there was no increase in 14,000 polish at 3 hours vs 20 hours; tells me the polish did not break down at all. But it slapped a polish fast, surprising. That could be a problem w/500/1000. Cleaned it out and getting ready to do a 50,000 polish. How long will that take, 16 minutes LOL. Funny thing, fluorite was a joke compared to obsidian, go figure. The thing that relieved me the most was getting a shine out of AO 1000 on agate in 3 days. That was big. sounds like you got that one whipped.
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 12:37:19 GMT -5
Thanks captbob. I got apatite, celestite, amazonstone, and a few others to battle with. Keep me in line please sir.
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Post by jakesrocks on Jan 22, 2015 12:55:58 GMT -5
I would be very careful using sugar as a thickening agent. On a couple of occasions I've had bad experiences with it. Make sure everything is absolutely clean before using sugar. And DO NOT use any sort of organic material for padding, such as wood chips, walnut shells or leather scraps. The mixture of sugar, water & organic material will cause fermentation, resulting in gasses building up in your tumbler barrel. The lid will be blown off of your barrel, resulting in one heck of a mess to clean up, and a very foul smell in your shop.
I've used plain old oatmeal as a thickening agent with good results. Just be sure not to let your rocks dry out before rinsing them. If you allow them to dry, the oatmeal sticks like glue.
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 22, 2015 14:10:59 GMT -5
So if the sugar is getting you a nice shine why are you going above that and using AO 14k and above?
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 18:51:57 GMT -5
So if the sugar is getting you a nice shine why are you going above that and using AO 14k and above? Just to see if it can polish better. never used 50,000 in a vibe, and gave it a try.
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 22, 2015 18:56:27 GMT -5
So if the sugar is getting you a nice shine why are you going above that and using AO 14k and above? Just to see if it can polish better. never used 50,000 in a vibe, and gave it a try. Say I run my AO500 for 3-5days (like I did my snakeskin) and have a good polish, but if I want it better clean the sludge and add some sugar for X many days?
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jamesp
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Member since October 2012
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 19:04:24 GMT -5
Just to see if it can polish better. never used 50,000 in a vibe, and gave it a try. Say I run my AO500 for 3-5days (like I did my snakeskin) and have a good polish, but if I want it better clean the sludge and add some sugar for X many days? I only ran it for 20 hours. And it looked the same at 3 hours as it did at 20 hours. Freaked me out, I was thinking it would take a day at least. I will be anxious to try sugar in 500 step.
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 22, 2015 19:06:35 GMT -5
jamesp but after 3 hours was def a difference in shine?
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 19:13:27 GMT -5
jamesp but after 3 hours was def a difference in shine? The stone on the left had no polish. It was actually a poor preparation for 14,000 polish. Stone on the right looked the same, before it had the 3 hour polish. Yes, stone on right was in polish 3 hours, that's all. That is what surprised me so much.
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Post by captbob on Jan 22, 2015 19:14:49 GMT -5
So if the sugar is getting you a nice shine why are you going above that and using AO 14k and above? Tumbler polish is AO and usually 14,000. Don't you use AO polish Broseph?
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Post by broseph82 on Jan 22, 2015 19:15:56 GMT -5
So if the sugar is getting you a nice shine why are you going above that and using AO 14k and above? Tumbler polish is AO and usually 14,000. Don't you use AO polish Broseph? I have some AO polish (5lbs) but wasn't sure of the number.
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jamesp
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Post by jamesp on Jan 22, 2015 21:39:02 GMT -5
The next question-- Can 500 be run in three hours, 1000 in 3 hours, 5000 in 3 hours and 14,000 in 3 hours ?? hmmm. That just can't be. I gotta try that.
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Post by captbob on Jan 22, 2015 22:58:36 GMT -5
The next question-- Can 500 be run in three hours, 1000 in 3 hours, 5000 in 3 hours and 14,000 in 3 hours ?? hmmm. That just can't be. I gotta try that.
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