RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Nov 26, 2024 13:19:42 GMT -5
Lately when doing the clean out of the Harbor Freight rotary barrels I am finding about 1/4 inch of sticky gunk with smaller rocks imbedded therein at the bottom of the barrel.
I have not changed the amount of rocks, grit or water from what I have always used and did not have this gunkiness occurring.
Is it normal ? Can it be prevented ? Would some Borax in the run help? If so... how much ?
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ronnsrockroundup
starting to spend too much on rocks
Hurry up and wait.
Member since October 2023
Posts: 167
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Post by ronnsrockroundup on Nov 26, 2024 15:02:02 GMT -5
Lately when doing the clean out of the Harbor Freight rotary barrels I am finding about 1/4 inch of sticky gunk with smaller rocks imbedded therein at the bottom of the barrel. I have not changed the amount of rocks, grit or water from what I have always used and did not have this gunkiness occurring. Is it normal ? Can it be prevented ? Would some Borax in the run help? If so... how much ? Have you changed the type of rock your tumbling? I've noticed softer stuff makes my slurry thicker. I usually have about the described amount of sticky sludge after a week long tumble. I don't personally think that Borax would help, kinda the opposite. Maybe more water ratio would thin it. Hopefully the others will chime in as well. |
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mdjunkie
noticing nice landscape pebbles
Member since November 2023
Posts: 87 
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Post by mdjunkie on Nov 26, 2024 15:47:03 GMT -5
I agree, it sounds like softer rocks causing a thick layer of sludge and small rocks (usually ones with a flat side) to accumulate at the bottom. I can't see it having anything to do with the barrel brand, they are pretty much all the same.
Mike
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RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Nov 26, 2024 17:02:26 GMT -5
Lately when doing the clean out of the Harbor Freight rotary barrels I am finding about 1/4 inch of sticky gunk with smaller rocks imbedded therein at the bottom of the barrel. I have not changed the amount of rocks, grit or water from what I have always used and did not have this gunkiness occurring. Is it normal ? Can it be prevented ? Would some Borax in the run help? If so... how much ? I've noticed softer stuff makes my slurry thicker. I usually have about the described amount of sticky sludge after a week long tumble. I don't personally think that Borax would help, kinda the opposite. Maybe more water ratio would thin it. Hopefully the others will chime in as well. Pretty much the same sort of rocks being tumbled ... common Lake Superior "pretty" rocks and assorted field and river glacial debris types. The top watery part looks pretty much as it always has but this "settled" stuff on the bottom is puzzling because it's a horizontal barrel that gets periodically picked up and shaken to keep things stirred up ... especially because nothing in the routine seems to have changed. If you have the same sludge, perhaps it's normal and it's been there but I never paid any attention to it. |
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stonemitch
off to a rocking start
Member since April 2024
Posts: 18
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Post by stonemitch on Nov 27, 2024 15:32:37 GMT -5
I had 2 tumblers going for weeks, then a few months ago, I unplugged them and they have been sitting. When I stopped them rolling, I took a quick peek inside the 5 pound barrels and it was the normal looking thinnish grey sludge. Not thick at all. Today when I opened them both for the first time in months, all the rocks, media and water had thickened and was all stuck on the bottom. Same as above. I got them rolling again after adding water to cover the rocks. Now it just a waiting game.  |
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RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Nov 27, 2024 16:16:57 GMT -5
I had 2 tumblers going for weeks, then a few months ago, I unplugged them and they have been sitting. When I stopped them rolling, I took a quick peek inside the 5 pound barrels and it was the normal looking thinnish grey sludge. Not thick at all. Today when I opened them both for the first time in months, all the rocks, media and water had thickened and was all stuck on the bottom. Same as above. I got them rolling again after adding water to cover the rocks. Now it just a waiting game. Whenever I stop a rolling or vibratory session, if I am not going right on to another stage, I wash the rocks really well and leave them in an ice cream bucket of water .. am that paranoid about "stuff" drying on the rocks. Good luck on your cleaning project. May have to go back to a stage one and start over to remove the gunk "patina". |
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lapidary1234
spending too much on rocks
"If you like rocks you can't be all bad!!" ~ old timer quote
Member since October 2021
Posts: 325
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Post by lapidary1234 on Nov 30, 2024 0:12:26 GMT -5
If you're picking rocks up indiscriminately from the beach (and surrounding areas) of lake superior you will have stones of varying hardnesses. Especially the ones that look like granite. The black flecks are softer than the surrounding rock and prove difficult to tumble. Not saying it can't be done but it adds difficulty for sure.
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RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Nov 30, 2024 0:17:58 GMT -5
If you're picking rocks up indiscriminately from the beach (and surrounding areas) of lake superior you will have stones of varying hardnesses. Especially the ones that look like granite. The black flecks are softer than the surrounding rock and prove difficult to tumble. Not saying it can't be done but it adds difficulty for sure. You rang ? 
The granite types tend to do fine until the final polish stage when undercutting takes over. I have learned to love the nooks and crannies as part of their charm ... since they seem to be unavoidable. |
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raindropsroses
off to a rocking start
Member since August 2024
Posts: 13
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Post by raindropsroses on Dec 1, 2024 16:12:39 GMT -5
I just had this exact thing happen to me with a load of petrified wood so I know it wasn’t softer material that did it.
Very strange and I was going to ask the same question
I was hoping maybe others that have had this would know what caused it.
The tumbler was turning all week never just sitting.
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RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Dec 1, 2024 17:41:11 GMT -5
I just had this exact thing happen to me with a load of petrified wood so I know it wasn’t softer material that did it. Very strange and I was going to ask the same question I was hoping maybe others that have had this would know what caused it. The tumbler was turning all week never just sitting. The part that puzzles me is not so much about the "gunk" itself .... I know that is what is ( I think) colloquially known as "rock snot" and ground to a powder grit ... but why it is jammed up on the bottom of the constantly rolling barrels even when the barrels have been taken off and shaken to "stir things around" a few times during the week. NOT a major mystery (or problem) ... more curiosity! |
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ronnsrockroundup
starting to spend too much on rocks
Hurry up and wait.
Member since October 2023
Posts: 167
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Post by ronnsrockroundup on Dec 1, 2024 18:39:03 GMT -5
I just had this exact thing happen to me with a load of petrified wood so I know it wasn’t softer material that did it. Very strange and I was going to ask the same question I was hoping maybe others that have had this would know what caused it. The tumbler was turning all week never just sitting. Perhaps your pet wood is opalized wood which would make it much softer than agatized. |
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ronnsrockroundup
starting to spend too much on rocks
Hurry up and wait.
Member since October 2023
Posts: 167
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Post by ronnsrockroundup on Dec 1, 2024 18:42:05 GMT -5
I just had this exact thing happen to me with a load of petrified wood so I know it wasn’t softer material that did it. Very strange and I was going to ask the same question I was hoping maybe others that have had this would know what caused it. The tumbler was turning all week never just sitting. The part that puzzles me is not so much about the "gunk" itself .... I know that is what is ( I think) colloquially known as "rock snot" and ground to a powder grit ... but why it is jammed up on the bottom of the constantly rolling barrels even when the barrels have been taken off and shaken to "stir things around" a few times during the week. NOT a major mystery (or problem) ... more curiosity! Are you noticing any coarse grit still in the sludge? Not rock chips but actual pieces of sic. |
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RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Dec 2, 2024 0:16:44 GMT -5
The part that puzzles me is not so much about the "gunk" itself .... I know that is what is ( I think) colloquially known as "rock snot" and ground to a powder grit ... but why it is jammed up on the bottom of the constantly rolling barrels even when the barrels have been taken off and shaken to "stir things around" a few times during the week. NOT a major mystery (or problem) ... more curiosity! Not rock chips but actual pieces of sic. Nope ... |
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ronnsrockroundup
starting to spend too much on rocks
Hurry up and wait.
Member since October 2023
Posts: 167
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Post by ronnsrockroundup on Dec 2, 2024 0:23:23 GMT -5
Are you noticing any coarse grit still in the sludge? Not rock chips but actual pieces of sic. Nope ... With that being said, it seems as though it must be settling rapidly as you take the lid off of the barrel and not sticking to the bottom. I would think it would trap grit otherwise. Maybe someone else will comment. Hope it helps, I'm still learning as well. |
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Post by Rockoonz on Dec 2, 2024 5:14:32 GMT -5
When you say sticky, is the solid mass actually tacky, or just solid?
If it's tacky it's from the rubber formulation used to make the barrels, a little more isoprene in the tread stock they generally use will cause it to revert to a non cured state. I can imagine a Chinese rubber compounder would have no problem with substitutions if they are low on something.
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jamesp
Cave Dweller 
Member since October 2012
Posts: 36,619
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Post by jamesp on Dec 2, 2024 10:17:52 GMT -5
Pouring fresh concrete into water will set just as hard as when pouring a sidewalk or driveway out of water. So when tumbling concrete chunks the slurry can set hard when the tumbler is turned off for a time. Concrete is fairly soft so it makes a lot of slurry in a hurry. Rocks with high lime content can act similar. When stopping a rotary tumbler shaping common soda-lime glass in step 1 the slurry can solidify in 10 minutes so hard that the contents must be pried out of the barrel with a screwdriver or similar tool. If tumbling soft calcite or fluorite rest assured that the slurry will build quickly in shaping step 1. Probably overnite. It is guaranteed. Tumbling away just the soft lime coating on petrified coral using zero grit because the white lime coating was loaded with quartz splinters formed in the the coral tubes that served well as abrasive. The white 'sludge' about had to be cleaned out daily or constipation(good description) would occur. Going the other way, kaolin based medicines cure diarrhea, kaolin is the byproduct of tumbling felspar and felspar bearing granite. www.flickr.com/photos/67205364@N06/albums/72157634669474396/ After a few days the naturally stained lime has been removed:  |
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RockyBeach
spending too much on rocks
Member since July 2023
Posts: 361
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Post by RockyBeach on Dec 2, 2024 11:33:50 GMT -5
When you say sticky, is the solid mass actually tacky, or just solid? If it's tacky it's from the rubber formulation used to make the barrels, a little more isoprene in the tread stock they generally use will cause it to revert to a non cured state. I can imagine a Chinese rubber compounder would have no problem with substitutions if they are low on something. It's tacky ... very much like clay. The color varies depending on the color of the rocks being tumbled. I do "get" where the stuff is coming from ... the rocks and grit... it's more curiosity about why it gets deposited on the bottoms of the constantly turning barrels. There certainly is not that much "settling out" happening in the short walk from furnace room to washing sink .. so much so that smaller rocks are imbedded in it. |
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raindropsroses
off to a rocking start
Member since August 2024
Posts: 13
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Post by raindropsroses on Dec 3, 2024 20:12:08 GMT -5
Yes exactly. A thick layer with all the small media imbedded in it. Clearly it took some time to get that way, not just “settling “ for a few minutes.
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ronnsrockroundup
starting to spend too much on rocks
Hurry up and wait.
Member since October 2023
Posts: 167
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Post by ronnsrockroundup on Dec 3, 2024 21:03:42 GMT -5
When you say sticky, is the solid mass actually tacky, or just solid? If it's tacky it's from the rubber formulation used to make the barrels, a little more isoprene in the tread stock they generally use will cause it to revert to a non cured state. I can imagine a Chinese rubber compounder would have no problem with substitutions if they are low on something. It's tacky ... very much like clay. The color varies depending on the color of the rocks being tumbled. I do "get" where the stuff is coming from ... the rocks and grit... it's more curiosity about why it gets deposited on the bottoms of the constantly turning barrels. There certainly is not that much "settling out" happening in the short walk from furnace room to washing sink .. so much so that smaller rocks are imbedded in it. I'll have to try a test where I leave the barrel horizontal the entire way to lid opening then looking at the "bottom" of the barrel to see if there is sludge built up there or now on the lowest side of the barrel. |
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