soldering

[croeber]

Question about soldering. I've only been tumbling a short time but with a few polished stones on my hands....I'm wondering about making some pendants. I've seen some pendants with an organic look to them, sort of fluid silver surrounding the stone. Most recently there was a pic. in the photograph section, it was work done by "solder woman." I've already got a soldering iron, wondered if this could be used for some beginning jewelry work. Or is a torch the only thing you'll ever use for jewelry? I know I need to get a book or something and do a lot more investigation, but just thought I'd post anyway.
Thanks! Cari

[krazydiamond]

you need a torch and all sorts of start up paraphenalia. your best bet is to find a local university/art school that offers a basic silver soldering course. take that and then decide whether you want to invest in your own set up.

KD

[croeber]

Yeah. I guess I should have known. There are some jewelry classes here in St. Louis that I've checked out in the past but never signed up. Guess I better go that route. Thanks!

Cari

[earthdog]

Well, my piece was done with a soldering iron. The wife watched her do it and even took one of her classes. It was done with solder.

[blarneystone]

Earth - Is that piece done with Silver Solder? .. I'm curious to know the technique.

[earthdog]

I think it was, I'll have to ask the wife.

[blarneystone]

Cool, Thanks

[croeber]

Wow, I would be really excited to know the technique - especially if it's done with a soldering iron and not a torch!! I would be thrilled if I already have some of the tools to start making pendants. I realize, lots of research to do now. And thanks for any additional help that you guys can provide on this board!

[docone31]

Even "Silver solder" applied by an iron is too high in toxic elements to wear. Those solders appear to work, untill time, and the corrosive environment of skin proximity occurs.
Even high temp solders are an issue. Silver solder, classic for soldering silver, technically a brazing, the easy solder has a very high cadmium level.
In regards to jewelery schools, they are good to get your feet wet, but, a lot of techniques will be unlearned and modified. However, one must have a starting point.
When I teach jeweley making and repair, I start by teaching how to melt metal. I firmly believe with the temperatures involved, heat control is the primary issue.
Get some Romex wire, 16gu, strip it, lay it on a 2 X 12. Get a common propane torch. Ace Hardware, Home Depot, etc. Lay the wire on the 2 X 12. Light up the torch and hold it upside down. That delivers the most heat. Heat the wire on the 2 X 12 and start it glowing. Sprinkle Borax. Here it is found in the Walmart Laundry department. It is laundry detergent. Sprinkle the Borax on the wire, and where ever the lumber piece is burning. Keep heating untill the wire makes a ball. From there manipulate the ball, fuse it into another piece of wire, fuse two wires together. Play with it. Melt enough make a large ball. A good picleing agent is pool acid. Throw some in a crock pot, heat it up, throw in the ball. It removes the firescale, flux, and makes it easy to solder.
When you can manipulate the wire as you want to, get some Hard Solder for silver. Use the Borax as flux and solder some pieces together.
That is how it is done.
Good luck.

[blarneystone]

Great info Doc... Thanks!

Pool Acid = Muriatic Acid?

[181lizard]

Doc...what kind of toxic elements ya talkin bout? The kind that would make you sick if you wore it?

[rallyrocks]

181lizard said:

Doc...what kind of toxic elements ya talkin bout? The kind that would make you sick if you wore it?

Until really recently most (plumbing and electrical- non-jewelry) solders were mostly lead, as you know- lead is pretty nasty stuff and not something you'd want to have rubbing on your skin.

Likewise some "silver solders" (typically mostly tin with some silver, zinc and copper alloyed) have had cadmium (also a nasty heavy metal carcinogen) and other metals.

But I would expect that most modern SAC (Tin/Silver/Copper alloys that have become the predominant lead-free solder formulation) are reasonably non-toxic not that the fluxes are safe- but that becomes a whole 'nother topic for discussion....

[docone31]

Ralleyrocks, you about dialed it in.
With the lead free plumbing solders, the release of metals is based on neutral waters, and flow rates. Now, with R/O systems, the release of specific metals is algorythically increased. That being said, the interaction of proteins against "safe" metals becomes an issue with low temperature solders. Hence plating, although the plating process leaves microscopic pores for enzyme intrusion, and oxide/sulphate exchange.
With high temperature solders, copper release is minimized after soldering. The silvers used in the solders, including gold solder become more stable after the soldering/brazing process.
The look of the mentioned pendant almost cannot be accomplished however with high temperature solders. There is the trade off. Fashion comes with a price.
I strongly reccomend, using fingernail polish on the contact points when wearing low temperature solder. This is a lacquer and does for a short time encapsulate or isolate skin/metal contact. I have reccomended to many people using fingernail polish when they develop an allergy to gold, or silver and the design does not lend itself to modification such as exchanging ear wires.
As long as you know the rules,
you know how to play the game.

[blarneystone]

You guys are awesome. Thanks for the info!!!

[181lizard]

Man! fer a minute, I was sure my head was gonna explode cause I didn't understand a dang thing Doc was talking about...but then he mentioned fingernail polish & all got right with the world!

[rockds]

I'm taking a class on metal smithing and jewlery making starting in a couple of weeks. I glad to hear what you said doc because I was think the 1st part would be pretty boaring. The 1st few classes all they do is discuss metal melting

[yeahda1]

I'd check with your local rock club some have silversmithing classes ours has one and it is only $10.00 + materials for members at least this would let you know how far you want to pusue it
Dick B.

[rockhard]

Clear coating is the only way my mother can wear any kind of metal. Nail glue (glue for acrylic fingernails) is sturdier, and made of the same stuff as surgical glue for body tissues, so I assume it's even less toxic, at least after it's finished curing. A couple coats of that should seal anything up pretty well for a while, and it gets hard enough to smooth and re-polish with a dremel (gently).

The only drawback is that it smells evil until it's dry.

I'm often buying nail glue for all kinds of things, it's like superglue but better, who cares if they look at me funny LOL.

[rallyrocks]

rockds said:

I'm taking a class on metal smithing and jewlery making starting in a couple of weeks. I glad to hear what you said doc because I was think the 1st part would be pretty boaring. The 1st few classes all they do is discuss metal melting

Doc's suggested self-teaching practice method is a great way to build skills, but I wouldn't forgo a couple of hours discussion with a knowledgeable expert on the subject of melting metals, there are a lot of subtle things to metallurgy that will come in handy when you get to working different alloys and different work methods.