RiverOtter
spending too much on rocks
Member since January 2004
Posts: 339
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Post by RiverOtter on Jun 23, 2004 11:42:40 GMT -5
I need some advice please. I was going to purchase some square and half-round wire but wasn't sure what to get dead soft or half-hard. I know soft would be easier to work with than half-hard right? But in order to get the two I need I have to purchase either silver, gold filled or 14K. So depending on the type of metal does it make a difference? I mean wouldn't dead soft be too soft for 14K since gold is fairly soft anyway? Any input would be grateful because I don't want to waste my money getting the wrong thing. Also, I want to get silver colored wire but I want something that won't tarnish. Doesn't sterling silver tarnish? And if so, what else can I use that is silver colored, won't tarnish and isn't nickle?
Thanks, Otter
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Post by docone31 on Jun 23, 2004 12:41:54 GMT -5
Good questions. I use 1/2 hard for all my wire. All 14K work hardens and fractures. That is why you do not see it in wire wraps It goes so far and cracks off. You cannot anneal the wire on the stone. There is no silver coloured wire that does not either tarnish or look out of place. Sterling tarnishes and using a dry cloth and baking soda takes care of the problem without destroying the stone. Polish the wire before wrapping and buff once it is on.
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Post by hermatite on Jun 23, 2004 13:19:40 GMT -5
I use dead soft for almost all my stuff. I've tried half hard but I find it really hard on my hands and fingers...after making a bracelet at christmas with it my wrist ached for about two days. Dead soft will also work harden so I've never had a problem with it not keeping shape or anything like that. Now doc is going to know more than me, but I've made a bracelet from fine silver...also dead soft and so far have had no problem with it tarnishing. Fine silver is more pure than sterling. I've read that the tarnishing problem is greatly diminished with fine silver. However because of it's purity it's more expensive.
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Post by krazydiamond on Jun 23, 2004 16:31:29 GMT -5
keeping silver, sterling or otherwise in sealable baggies helps retard the tarnish reaction. keep a cloth handy for a quick buff before wearing or displaying and if you can afford one, an ionic jewelry cleaner can clean gold and silver without damaging the stones.
KD
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RiverOtter
spending too much on rocks
Member since January 2004
Posts: 339
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Post by RiverOtter on Jun 23, 2004 23:38:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the info. That helps. Next question. ;D Would gold filled be better for wire wrapping then 14K? And what about "white" gold? Do they even make it in wire and can you use it for wrapping or does it pose the same problem as 14K?
Herm, where would a person find fine silver wire?
Thankfully I did finally find square and half round in copper. I wasn't really ready to buy the expensive stuff until I've had a bit more practice.
Now, if I can just find some metalsmithing or silversmithing classes I'll be all set!
Otter
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Bostonpat
off to a rocking start
Member since November 2003
Posts: 17
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Post by Bostonpat on Jun 23, 2004 23:52:55 GMT -5
Otter - Lots of folks on this board use gold filled wire for wrapping : forums.delphiforums.com/wirejewelry/startCheck it out - they are very helpful answering any questions you may have. A good basic metalsmithing book is The Complete Metalsmith by Tim McCreight - I'd say it was a good, basic book - even with classes this will come in quite handy! Pat
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Post by docone31 on Jun 24, 2004 1:26:39 GMT -5
Gold filled, or 14K20, is the best for wire wrapping. It has a core of Merlin's gold, essentially a bronze core. It is then overlaid with a sheet of 14K gold. It is not a plating process, and can be soldered with plum gold solder. 14K is an alloy of gold, 56% 22k plus alloying materials. White gold is 56% 22K plus nickel, and other bronze alloys. Heated to surface boil, both ykt and wkt will boil off the copper and or nickel, and become quite brittle. Anealing gold , the kt alloys produces surface fractures when worked. Gold filled, or 14K20, meaning 14kt/20% is mechanically and chemically bonded. Gold has unique properties that it can be drawn to one molecule in thickness and still be integral. I draw my wire. I roll square in my rolling mill, and then use a draw plate to produce wires of differing shape and diameter. I also do this with my silvers. .999 and .925. When purchasing metals, always purchase by the ounce. Most metal refiners throw in the drawing. When I purchase wire, I get six or more ounces, and the price for the metal is the same as if I purchased bullion. When anealing, use a reducing flame, or a one gas torch. A stable or enrichening flame induces O2 into the metal and produces oxides. To combat oxides under oridnary anealing, coat with alcohol, 92% and boric acid. Flame off and aneal. After anealing put wire into sodium bisulfate, pool acid, or pickle to remove firescale and copper oxides. Polish by pulling through a cloth with dry baking soda and wrap away. Good luck.
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Post by hermatite on Jun 24, 2004 9:24:03 GMT -5
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Post by creativeminded on Jun 24, 2004 9:40:47 GMT -5
I use soft wire for all of my wrappings, I have tried half-hard gold fill and it was just too stiff to get a good wrap. If you want something that isn't going to tarnish you can go to www.parawire.com and look at what they have I have used their silver coated copper in many of my wrapped pieces as well as jewelry, and it looks really nice and is really easy to use. Tami
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Post by hermatite on Jun 24, 2004 9:57:52 GMT -5
hey creativeminded...good site! I need to add a proviso about fine silver...it's wicked soft...think 19 k gold or 24 k gold...you know? It'll scratch and pit and wont' stand up to much rough wear. In fact though I use it for bracelet links (mainly because I can fuse them as opposed to soldering) I use the sterling to make the findings because they'll stand up to the tugging and rougher wear.
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Post by creativeminded on Jun 24, 2004 10:02:01 GMT -5
Hermatite, do you make regular jumprings and cut them apart? If you do, do you use a dremel or a jeweler's saw? This is why I ask if you use a dremel do you use any type of jig to cut the coils?
I am using a jeweler's saw and would like to find something that isn't too expensive or something that I can make to help me cut the jumpring quicker with the dremel.
Tami
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Post by creativeminded on Jun 24, 2004 10:07:25 GMT -5
To add to my recent post, I have started using sterling silver and gold fill soft for my wrappings and have been very pleased. I haven't warn the pieces I have made much, so I don't know how they will wear.
Tami
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Post by hermatite on Jun 24, 2004 10:13:55 GMT -5
When I make sterling jump rings I cut them apart with the jewelers saw. I got a book called "making silver chains" that I really like. For me the author (forget the name...sorry) really explained things in a way I could understand (<--- not the sharpest pencil in the cup ifyaknowwhatimean). Mostly I'm lazy and try to use the fine silver. It's soft and I can just fuse the links rather than solder them. And I don't have to cut them from the coil with a saw. I can just snip them with regular pliers...much easier imho. But like I said this wire won't work for everything so when I have to, I solder.
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Post by creativeminded on Jun 24, 2004 11:43:28 GMT -5
Thanks, I was just curious. Tami
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Post by hermatite on Jun 24, 2004 14:51:56 GMT -5
RiverOtter, I had a duh moment. I forgot to tell you to check About.com under jewlery making...there's a really excellent section on what wire to use for what on their newsletter. If you can't find it, just let me know and I'd be happy to email it to you.
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RiverOtter
spending too much on rocks
Member since January 2004
Posts: 339
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Post by RiverOtter on Jun 25, 2004 0:29:33 GMT -5
Thanks all for the comments. That really helps with deciding which wire to buy. It can get really confusing for someone just starting out. I went ahead and purchased that copper I was telling you about. I needed something other than round to practice with. And of course it will come and I won't have time to play with it. Tami, FYI, I read somewhere that you can use a cutoff wheel on a dremel to cut your jump rings. I haven't tried it yet but it sounds like it would work. Otter
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Post by krazydiamond on Jun 25, 2004 19:42:26 GMT -5
this has helped me as well, as i am fairly new to wire wrapping of any kind. i must say, Doc's post made me feel In the Prescence of the Lord.....fer cryin out loud.
i have finally found a way to live..... KD
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RiverOtter
spending too much on rocks
Member since January 2004
Posts: 339
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Post by RiverOtter on Jun 25, 2004 23:42:09 GMT -5
Yes KD, Doc's always a wealth of information. Our resident expert on jewelry making. I thank the gods we have him!
Otter
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Post by creativeminded on Jun 29, 2004 13:57:59 GMT -5
There is only one problem with a cutoff wheel with the rings I am trying to cut, it makes the cut too wide and then I am left with a misshapen ring. I have tried a thin diamond embedded cutoff blade and that didn't work, it just got hot and made a mess of my coil, I have also tried a regular, very thin, dremel saw blade and it kept getting stuck. I think I will adventually find something that will work, but until then I will use my jeweler's saw. Tami
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