Chalcedony Paperweight - Gunlock Utah

[NevadaBill]

I will have to write a trip report one day, but when first stumbling about some territory that a fellow RTH'er clued me in to, I started finding large chunks of Chalcedony.

I have not found stuff like this before, and certainly not of the sizes that I was getting.  I don't really know what to call it.  It is a Agate family likely.  But I just call it Chalcedony because the smaller samples remind me of stuff I have found in Northern California.

This guy was sitting in a bin next to the slab saw.  The idea was to turn him in to pendants.  But when I walked by yesterday I heard something whispering in my ear.  I went over and this guy said "Hey buddy!  I am a paperweight!.  Don't chop me all up in to pieces.  See that cab grinder over there!  Put me on that machine for an hour or two and see what you come up with!".

So I did.  This should be considered a first draft because there is still work to be done.  But I wanted to share it.  There is much concave and convex to the face of this.  I could have just take a straight saw cut to two faces of this stone, and then polished it up.  But I wanted more character.  

There is a clear crack that goes right through this, on the right side.  It can be seen easily.  But even though I ground on this for a couple hours, the crack stayed stable.

I am not sure what to do with it.  My wife still says "Cut it!  Slice it!  Make pendants for everyone!".  But I like it as a paperweight I think.

I just don't know if i should remove the part of the stone with the crack and polish that side.  I don't know if I should take off more material or not.  I do know that I need to Dremel out the concave parts that I cannot get to with the grinding wheels.  It is not finished:

Here is another look:

I could chop it up I guess.  Maybe it doesn't have enough desk appeal.  But I usually like to leave a stone as large as I can.  Big stuff is prettier to look at. 

We'll see.

Any suggestions, comments, or critique on how to make it better are always appreciated!

[jasoninsd]

Okay, so I'm just starting my cabbing "life", so I'm starting to look at certain rocks to see what they could "become".

However, I still see rocks which are begging to have little or nothing done with them and just beg to be admired in their "natural" state...or as close to that state as possible.

I think if it were me, I'd be looking at the latter of those two options in this case.

I've been hounding a bunch of rocks which I don't know if they're a bubble gum agate or a water/lace agate of some kind. They have VERY similar characteristics to the one you've got pictured. I have no idea what they really are, but I'm leaning toward what people around here are calling a water or lace agate...

[quartz]

I agree with your thought on a larger rock having more desk appeal, think the same way. That one looks to have a good deal of appeal just as it is, maybe with a little shining up.

[kyoti]

I wouldn't chop it up either. It's a cool rock! If you choose to do anything to it, I'd probably just tidy up that small area of fractures on the right in the first picture. You could also try removing a bit more matrix on the right to expose the banding. If it could damage the banding though, I wouldn't try it. I've had pretty good luck with a flap wheel on my Dremel or drill for getting into curved or recessed areas. The one I have actually put a light polish on my sagenite agate which surprised me.

[NevadaBill]

Nov 24, 2020 21:15:32 GMT -5 jasoninsd said:

Okay, so I'm just starting my cabbing "life", so I'm starting to look at certain rocks to see what they could "become".

However, I still see rocks which are begging to have little or nothing done with them and just beg to be admired in their "natural" state...or as close to that state as possible.

I think if it were me, I'd be looking at the latter of those two options in this case.

I've been hounding a bunch of rocks which I don't know if they're a bubble gum agate or a water/lace agate of some kind. They have VERY similar characteristics to the one you've got pictured. I have no idea what they really are, but I'm leaning toward what people around here are calling a water or lace agate...

Thanks for your input Jason!  I should probably search your posts to see pictures of those Agates which you refer to.  Perhaps you have posted them already.  If not, the maybe you could drop a picture or two in here!  I like pictures of rocks!

I think this one is going to stay large.  I just was soliciting tips from folks whom might have some tips on how to grind this one or treat it, so that it could be displayed best.  I am leaving 75% of it natural stone, and only planning to finish polish the faces that I started working on.

I have various wheels (leather) belts, and Dremel bits which could do the work.  I have Cerium Oxide, something called Lindt-"A", and AO 14,400 powders, which I've tried using in the past. 

But I just don't get it.  I mix with water in to a paste and try to apply to the stone, but mostly the stuff just goes flying.  I also have ZAM, which I mostly use on softer stones.

Some day I will figure this polishing stuff out.  Maybe I should read more! 

[NevadaBill]

Nov 24, 2020 21:28:41 GMT -5 quartz said:

I agree with your thought on a larger rock having more desk appeal, think the same way. That one looks to have a good deal of appeal just as it is, maybe with a little shining up.

Thanks for chiming in, Larry!  I think so too!  I like the little guy and don't really want to chop him up for pendants or other crafts.

I have some good polishing dusts (CO, AO, Linde-A, and ZAM).  And I think that many parts will have to be finished by hand, using a leather wheel or by hand using a Dremel.  I just don't have very good experience with the stuff yet.  Mostly I am thinking that I've been doing it wrong.

It would be cool to read a couple articles here (RTH) about finish polishing Agates by hand. 

I bet Mike (miket) would know something about that!  Mike!  Any ideas how to finish polish by hand?

[NevadaBill]

Nov 25, 2020 10:04:41 GMT -5 kyoti said:

I wouldn't chop it up either. It's a cool rock! If you choose to do anything to it, I'd probably just tidy up that small area of fractures on the right in the first picture. You could also try removing a bit more matrix on the right to expose the banding. If it could damage the banding though, I wouldn't try it. I've had pretty good luck with a flap wheel on my Dremel or drill for getting into curved or recessed areas. The one I have actually put a light polish on my sagenite agate which surprised me.

Thank you for chiming in!

I would also like to "tidy up" the rough areas on the right (first photo) to expose more banding.  There is a clear fracture that extends all the way from top to bottom, and goes clear through to the back side as well.  This can be seen.  So far it has not budged. 

One method to tidy up would be to just break off that whole piece.  But it would lose a good deal of interesting material in doing so.  It would be a lot cleaner looking for sure.  But I like to think that some folks might actually glue that piece back on if it were to fall off, to try to keep as much of the large chunk in tact as possible.  Kind of like how they do with fossils.  I will be grinding more away on that side though.  Maybe it will do as you mention, and expose more banding without enhancing the cracks or integrity of the stone.

Great idea to pick up a FLAP wheel for the Dremel!  I have not seen one these before.  I have grinding cones, barrels, and some buffing wheels, but I will pick up a FLAP wheel or more to see how they work!  Excellent idea!  Thank you!

[jasoninsd]

Nov 27, 2020 14:47:34 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Nov 24, 2020 21:15:32 GMT -5 jasoninsd said:

Okay, so I'm just starting my cabbing "life", so I'm starting to look at certain rocks to see what they could "become".

However, I still see rocks which are begging to have little or nothing done with them and just beg to be admired in their "natural" state...or as close to that state as possible.

I think if it were me, I'd be looking at the latter of those two options in this case.

I've been hounding a bunch of rocks which I don't know if they're a bubble gum agate or a water/lace agate of some kind. They have VERY similar characteristics to the one you've got pictured. I have no idea what they really are, but I'm leaning toward what people around here are calling a water or lace agate...

Thanks for your input Jason!  I should probably search your posts to see pictures of those Agates which you refer to.  Perhaps you have posted them already.  If not, the maybe you could drop a picture or two in here!  I like pictures of rocks!

I think this one is going to stay large.  I just was soliciting tips from folks whom might have some tips on how to grind this one or treat it, so that it could be displayed best.  I am leaving 75% of it natural stone, and only planning to finish polish the faces that I started working on.

I have various wheels (leather) belts, and Dremel bits which could do the work.  I have Cerium Oxide, something called Lindt-"A", and AO 14,400 powders, which I've tried using in the past. 

But I just don't get it.  I mix with water in to a paste and try to apply to the stone, but mostly the stuff just goes flying.  I also have ZAM, which I mostly use on softer stones.

Some day I will figure this polishing stuff out.  Maybe I should read more! 

I'm positive I have better examples somewhere, but I think they're buried in my five gallon buckets at the moment (I have about ten full buckets at the moment). Here's some pictures of the type of rocks I'm finding out here. I'm positive I have better examples, and when I find them (someday soon hopefully...) I'll post pics as well.

The first few pics are a couple different rocks I thought were similar to yours. The last couple are prairie agates and a Fairburn Agate.

[jasoninsd]

NevadaBill - another thing I forgot to mention, and I have no idea if this will work with with your polishing paste or not, but when it comes to using diamond paste with a dremel, you need to apply a silicone spray to the polishing/buffing wheels before applying the diamond paste to the wheels...

[NevadaBill]

Thanks for the tip jasoninsd, applying silicone spray to the wheels. Hmm. I need to read up on that right now!

Wow, those are the rocks you are picking up in your neighborhood!?! Those are all great. Those are all going to make great rocks. Do you tumble yet? I can tell that these have already spent a good deal of time in running water, and I bet that with just a little Stage 1 tumbling that some of them will come in to shape rather nicely. Buckets full!? That is a great problem to have!

Having only see the pictures above, I am with you in thinking that polishing up the outside of the attractive part of exposed stone and using them as desk rocks would be the way to go. My favorite is the 2nd to last one. And the colorful one before it is awesome too. Can't wait to see those when they are done.

If I could find stones like that, I would be spending less time on the RTH, and more time in riverbeds.

Thanks for sharing!

[jasoninsd]

Nov 27, 2020 16:26:36 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Thanks for the tip jasoninsd , applying silicone spray to the wheels. Hmm. I need to read up on that right now!

Wow, those are the rocks you are picking up in your neighborhood!?! Those are all great. Those are all going to make great rocks. Do you tumble yet? I can tell that these have already spent a good deal of time in running water, and I bet that with just a little Stage 1 tumbling that some of them will come in to shape rather nicely. Buckets full!? That is a great problem to have!

Having only see the pictures above, I am with you in thinking that polishing up the outside of the attractive part of exposed stone and using them as desk rocks would be the way to go. My favorite is the 2nd to last one. And the colorful one before it is awesome too. Can't wait to see those when they are done.

If I could find stones like that, I would be spending less time on the RTH, and more time in riverbeds.

Thanks for sharing!

Take a look at "extender fluid" which is what it's called for use with cabbing. I did a bunch of checking/reading/searching and found out silicone spray works the same as the extender fluid. Per Kingsley North Website, extender fluid is: "Silicon oil extender fluid to be used with diamond compounds as a cutting lubricant."

Silicon spray is $2.59 for a big aerosol can - versus $12 for a 4oz bottle of extender fluid. 

[miket]

Nov 27, 2020 14:51:52 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Nov 24, 2020 21:28:41 GMT -5 quartz said:

I agree with your thought on a larger rock having more desk appeal, think the same way. That one looks to have a good deal of appeal just as it is, maybe with a little shining up.

Thanks for chiming in, Larry!  I think so too!  I like the little guy and don't really want to chop him up for pendants or other crafts.

I have some good polishing dusts (CO, AO, Linde-A, and ZAM).  And I think that many parts will have to be finished by hand, using a leather wheel or by hand using a Dremel.  I just don't have very good experience with the stuff yet.  Mostly I am thinking that I've been doing it wrong.

It would be cool to read a couple articles here (RTH) about finish polishing Agates by hand. 

I bet Mike (miket ) would know something about that!  Mike!  Any ideas how to finish polish by hand?

I'd love to help but I really only shape with the dremel.  jasoninsd does some polishing by hand...

[jasoninsd]

Nov 28, 2020 5:51:07 GMT -5 miket said:

Nov 27, 2020 14:51:52 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Thanks for chiming in, Larry!  I think so too!  I like the little guy and don't really want to chop him up for pendants or other crafts.

I have some good polishing dusts (CO, AO, Linde-A, and ZAM).  And I think that many parts will have to be finished by hand, using a leather wheel or by hand using a Dremel.  I just don't have very good experience with the stuff yet.  Mostly I am thinking that I've been doing it wrong.

It would be cool to read a couple articles here (RTH) about finish polishing Agates by hand. 

I bet Mike (miket ) would know something about that!  Mike!  Any ideas how to finish polish by hand?

I'd love to help but I really only shape with the dremel.  jasoninsd does some polishing by hand...

I'm not saying this is correct...been trying to use as much info as I can acquire on RTH and YouTube and "winging" it for any of the blanks I'm filling in...

- I shape the stone with either a diamond disk or grinding wheel (I think it's a 1/4") for the dremel. I can get those from Menard's.
- Then I move onto the sanding using EZ Lock disks for the dremel. I could only find 60/120/240 grits for those. They wear out rather quickly, and aren't the cheapest, so what I've been doing is cutting out and super gluing on replacements. You can get full sheets of wet/dry sandpaper for this. I have 60/120/220/400/600/800/1000/1200/2000 grits. Some of those I got at Harbor Freight, and some off eBay. I don't generally go to the 2000 stage with this as the diamond paste covers that level.
- Then I move onto the diamond paste. I got a 7-pack of diamond paste off eBay. Each grit is 5oz. 1000/1500/2000/3000/4000/8000/10,000. I keep each syringe of grit in a separate ziplock bag along with a single buffing wheel. I prefer to use the 1/2" wheels as I think they're a little sturdier than the larger buffer wheels...but I'll use both. I make sure to use a piece of paper towel to wipe down the stone between each grit...using a separate piece of paper towel for each wipe down to avoid "contamination".
- Then I try to take some pictures of the final product and post them on RTH for critiques!


Like I said, this is what I've been doing and it seems to be working for me. I hope this points you in the right direction. There are some videos on YouTube of people using a dremel. Just search "dremel cabachon" and it will bring up a list you have to sort through.

[NevadaBill]

Nov 27, 2020 17:59:13 GMT -5 jasoninsd said:

Nov 27, 2020 16:26:36 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Thanks for the tip jasoninsd , applying silicone spray to the wheels. Hmm. I need to read up on that right now!

Wow, those are the rocks you are picking up in your neighborhood!?! Those are all great. Those are all going to make great rocks. Do you tumble yet? I can tell that these have already spent a good deal of time in running water, and I bet that with just a little Stage 1 tumbling that some of them will come in to shape rather nicely. Buckets full!? That is a great problem to have!

Having only see the pictures above, I am with you in thinking that polishing up the outside of the attractive part of exposed stone and using them as desk rocks would be the way to go. My favorite is the 2nd to last one. And the colorful one before it is awesome too. Can't wait to see those when they are done.

If I could find stones like that, I would be spending less time on the RTH, and more time in riverbeds.

Thanks for sharing!

Take a look at "extender fluid" which is what it's called for use with cabbing. I did a bunch of checking/reading/searching and found out silicone spray works the same as the extender fluid. Per Kingsley North Website, extender fluid is: "Silicon oil extender fluid to be used with diamond compounds as a cutting lubricant."

Silicon spray is $2.59 for a big aerosol can - versus $12 for a 4oz bottle of extender fluid. 

Thank goodness you posted this and re-reminded me to research the silicone spray for the adhesive to the polishing pads!  I have forgotten and moved on.

I am thinking the same thing.  Maybe they are the same thing.  This is an important tip and I am going to end up with some of it to try out.

I appreciate the response!

[NevadaBill]

Nov 28, 2020 5:51:07 GMT -5 miket said:

Nov 27, 2020 14:51:52 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Thanks for chiming in, Larry!  I think so too!  I like the little guy and don't really want to chop him up for pendants or other crafts.

I have some good polishing dusts (CO, AO, Linde-A, and ZAM).  And I think that many parts will have to be finished by hand, using a leather wheel or by hand using a Dremel.  I just don't have very good experience with the stuff yet.  Mostly I am thinking that I've been doing it wrong.

It would be cool to read a couple articles here (RTH) about finish polishing Agates by hand. 

I bet Mike (miket ) would know something about that!  Mike!  Any ideas how to finish polish by hand?

I'd love to help but I really only shape with the dremel.  jasoninsd does some polishing by hand...

Thanks miket.  When I mentioned "by hand", I meant "with Dremel".  It was burried in a post above.  But I appreciate your attention none the less!

[NevadaBill]

Nov 28, 2020 9:25:07 GMT -5 jasoninsd said:

Nov 28, 2020 5:51:07 GMT -5 miket said:

I'd love to help but I really only shape with the dremel.  jasoninsd does some polishing by hand...

I'm not saying this is correct...been trying to use as much info as I can acquire on RTH and YouTube and "winging" it for any of the blanks I'm filling in...

- I shape the stone with either a diamond disk or grinding wheel (I think it's a 1/4") for the dremel. I can get those from Menard's.
- Then I move onto the sanding using EZ Lock disks for the dremel. I could only find 60/120/240 grits for those. They wear out rather quickly, and aren't the cheapest, so what I've been doing is cutting out and super gluing on replacements. You can get full sheets of wet/dry sandpaper for this. I have 60/120/220/400/600/800/1000/1200/2000 grits. Some of those I got at Harbor Freight, and some off eBay. I don't generally go to the 2000 stage with this as the diamond paste covers that level.
- Then I move onto the diamond paste. I got a 7-pack of diamond paste off eBay. Each grit is 5oz. 1000/1500/2000/3000/4000/8000/10,000. I keep each syringe of grit in a separate ziplock bag along with a single buffing wheel. I prefer to use the 1/2" wheels as I think they're a little sturdier than the larger buffer wheels...but I'll use both. I make sure to use a piece of paper towel to wipe down the stone between each grit...using a separate piece of paper towel for each wipe down to avoid "contamination".
- Then I try to take some pictures of the final product and post them on RTH for critiques!


Like I said, this is what I've been doing and it seems to be working for me. I hope this points you in the right direction. There are some videos on YouTube of people using a dremel. Just search "dremel cabachon" and it will bring up a list you have to sort through.

Wow!  Thanks!  This was exactly the kind of information I was hoping to find.

I ended up purchasing a wide variety of Flat Lap Wheels for the Dremel tool.  This was upon advice from Kyoti's post above.  I purchased all varieties between 60 grit and 600 grit.  I am hoping to take out the grooves and imperfections from the concave surfaces that way initially.

I need to research Ebay for diamond paste in different grits I guess also.  It can't hurt.  I already have some of sanding wheels which you describe above, in various grits, as well as buffing wheels (both small 1/2 inch, and 1 inch varieties).

I think I am going to try using the Flap Wheels without polish perhaps, with water initially.

And then I will add some polish paste to the Flap Wheels (or sanding wheels) to see how that goes next.

At any rate the work has to be done by hand (read Dremel or with only sandpaper) from this point forward.

I really appreciate  you taking the time to describe your process.

If I circle back to this, then I will PM you.

[jasoninsd]

Nov 29, 2020 18:45:55 GMT -5 NevadaBill said:

Nov 28, 2020 9:25:07 GMT -5 jasoninsd said:

I'm not saying this is correct...been trying to use as much info as I can acquire on RTH and YouTube and "winging" it for any of the blanks I'm filling in...

- I shape the stone with either a diamond disk or grinding wheel (I think it's a 1/4") for the dremel. I can get those from Menard's.
- Then I move onto the sanding using EZ Lock disks for the dremel. I could only find 60/120/240 grits for those. They wear out rather quickly, and aren't the cheapest, so what I've been doing is cutting out and super gluing on replacements. You can get full sheets of wet/dry sandpaper for this. I have 60/120/220/400/600/800/1000/1200/2000 grits. Some of those I got at Harbor Freight, and some off eBay. I don't generally go to the 2000 stage with this as the diamond paste covers that level.
- Then I move onto the diamond paste. I got a 7-pack of diamond paste off eBay. Each grit is 5oz. 1000/1500/2000/3000/4000/8000/10,000. I keep each syringe of grit in a separate ziplock bag along with a single buffing wheel. I prefer to use the 1/2" wheels as I think they're a little sturdier than the larger buffer wheels...but I'll use both. I make sure to use a piece of paper towel to wipe down the stone between each grit...using a separate piece of paper towel for each wipe down to avoid "contamination".
- Then I try to take some pictures of the final product and post them on RTH for critiques!


Like I said, this is what I've been doing and it seems to be working for me. I hope this points you in the right direction. There are some videos on YouTube of people using a dremel. Just search "dremel cabachon" and it will bring up a list you have to sort through.

Wow!  Thanks!  This was exactly the kind of information I was hoping to find.

I ended up purchasing a wide variety of Flat Lap Wheels for the Dremel tool.  This was upon advice from Kyoti's post above.  I purchased all varieties between 60 grit and 600 grit.  I am hoping to take out the grooves and imperfections from the concave surfaces that way initially.

I need to research Ebay for diamond paste in different grits I guess also.  It can't hurt.  I already have some of sanding wheels which you describe above, in various grits, as well as buffing wheels (both small 1/2 inch, and 1 inch varieties).

I think I am going to try using the Flap Wheels without polish perhaps, with water initially.

And then I will add some polish paste to the Flap Wheels (or sanding wheels) to see how that goes next.

At any rate the work has to be done by hand (read Dremel or with only sandpaper) from this point forward.

I really appreciate  you taking the time to describe your process.

If I circle back to this, then I will PM you.

Bill, don't use the diamond paste with the sanding wheels. The diamond paste is used ONLY with the buffing wheels (the white wool ones).

The sanding wheels have their own grit and you DO want to wet sand (with water).

The Diamond Paste has it's own grit - which is a finer grit than the sand paper. You don't use water with the buffing pads (wheels) with diamond paste on them. Spray the buffing pads (wheels) with the silicone, then apply some diamond paste on the buffing surface (the circumference of the pad). I usually apply a few dots and then wipe it around the circumference with my fingers to kind of "push it" into the buffing pad surface a little...

[RWA3006]

Bill, that's a nice chalcedony you found. In that area I've found some similar and upon inspection I was able to determine they were weathered out of the rhyolite. I would keep it whole.

[NevadaBill]

Nov 29, 2020 21:52:49 GMT -5 RWA3006 said:

Bill, that's a nice chalcedony you found. In that area I've found some similar and upon inspection I was able to determine they were weathered out of the rhyolite. I would keep it whole.

Thank you for the nice words!

You are correct, Randy (RWA3006).  You were the one that clued me in to the location, and in your writings, mentioned that these were weathered out of Rhyolite too. 

When I was searching the hill sides I always kept this in mind as I looked around.  After a while this became apparent to me that the clear Chalcedony was in fact weathered out of Rhyolite!  As I found some few examples of this.

I expect that I will do a Trip Report on this location when I find the time to do some justice to it.  But here is a photo I snapped which exemplifies just that

What do you know!  It is a smaller example, but I think that it shows off your conclusions rather well!

I will do a trip report of the location some day and include little tidbits like this.

[NevadaBill]

Thanks jasoninsd for mentioning that. That makes sense. I am not sure why it would have occurred to me to add polish paste to a Flap Wheel which has grit embedded in it.

I am still waiting on supplies to arrive. I bought a ton of the little Flap Wheel guys and look forward to trying out polishing this big chunk with the Dremel and by hand.

I will probably hold off on posting pictures again, until I finish it or unless I have more questions.

I appreciate your time to explain these details to me!